Return-Path: Received: from eatspam.slcc.edu ([144.35.15.69] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.10) with ESMTP id 4620532 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Wed, 08 Feb 2012 21:18:16 +0100 X-ASG-Debug-ID: 1328732658-0437c6749689cf00001-edO5QZ Received: from vCAS1.slcc.int (vcas1.slcc.int [10.1.11.52]) by eatspam.slcc.edu with ESMTP id VSKSzLeEYHT2mSAp for ; Wed, 08 Feb 2012 13:24:18 -0700 (MST) X-Barracuda-Envelope-From: John.Morgan@slcc.edu Received: from EXCH.slcc.int ([127.0.0.1]) by vCAS1.slcc.int ([fe80::5023:faf7:26da:d5bf%11]) with mapi; Wed, 8 Feb 2012 13:24:19 -0700 From: John Morgan To: After Effects Mail List Date: Wed, 8 Feb 2012 13:24:17 -0700 Subject: RE: [AE] Love You Adobe Thread-Topic: [AE] Love You Adobe X-ASG-Orig-Subj: RE: [AE] Love You Adobe Thread-Index: AczmnYMo+E9OWkPgTmyRpBL1X97q6A== Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_EAE675A223415848A14AA69EBCDE9D0A5913843BF8EXCHslccint_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Barracuda-Connect: vcas1.slcc.int[10.1.11.52] X-Barracuda-Start-Time: 1328732658 X-Barracuda-URL: http://eatspam.slcc.edu:8000/cgi-mod/mark.cgi X-Virus-Scanned: by bsmtpd at slcc.edu X-Barracuda-Spam-Score: 0.00 X-Barracuda-Spam-Status: No, SCORE=0.00 using global scores of TAG_LEVEL=1000.0 QUARANTINE_LEVEL=1000.0 KILL_LEVEL=6.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE X-Barracuda-Spam-Report: Code version 3.2, rules version 3.2.2.87992 Rule breakdown below pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.00 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message --_000_EAE675A223415848A14AA69EBCDE9D0A5913843BF8EXCHslccint_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sorry for my snarkiness. :) As I understand, FCPX still doesn't work with n= ative file types and still forces background rendering because of commitmen= t to a proprietary codec. I watched the roll-out demo on YouTube, specifica= lly looking for those things and didn't see them. My longest project rarel= y exceeds 30 mins so according to your definition I'm not qualified to answ= er. But I DO use Pr on an HP Z800 box with dual quad-core Xeon i7's which n= et 16 processor cores in hyperthreaded mode, and Pr/Ae/En/AME use all 16 at= between 70% and 100%, depending on the type of function underway. I do hav= e a Quadro FX 4800 CUDA card and I do have a 16-drive (RAID 5) Rorke Data G= alaxy HDX2 (via 4Gb fiber channel) attached, and a Matrox MXO2LE system fo= r HD overlay on an external monitor. This system can playback more than 20 = layers of native P2 or Sony .mxf video, effects, Ae exports and FX in real = time without pre-rendering the timeline. The system is rock solid and I wo= uld trust it all the way across Australia for any length of project. Curren= tly using Pr 5.5.2. No FCP user has ever watched my 20-layer demo project and gone away telling= me his pixels are better. (An old personal joke dating back to the mac vs = pc wars of the '90s.) John From: After Effects Mail List [mailto:AE-List@media-motion.tv] On Behalf Of= James Culbertson Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2012 1:06 PM To: After Effects Mail List Subject: Re: [AE] F*k You Adobe Your description of Premiere could be confused with a description of FCPX .= ..my point being that just throwing out a bunch of specs doesn't guarantee = an app is ready for the most intensive projects in the real world. Again, I assume it is ready for these type of projects. I just had not hear= d any reports from the trenches from editors who also use AVID/FCP7 on a da= ily basis. Would you buy/rent a vehicle for a drive across the Australian outback base= d purely on a car makers specs, or would you want to talk to folks who have= already made the drive? James On Feb 8, 2012, at 11:49 AM, John Morgan wrote: Nah, nobody would use it for professional or broadcast work, what with its = scalable 64-bit architecture (meaning throw all the RAM and processors you = can afford at it), ability to work natively with all professional camera (a= nd many pro-sumer) codecs and file types, ability to hand off GPU processin= g to CUDA-approved cards, ability to manage differing pixel aspects and fra= merates on the same timeline.....and all of this in a nearly render-free (f= or timeline playback) environment. John From: After Effects Mail List [mailto:AE-List@media-motion.tv] On Behalf Of= James Culbertson Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2012 11:56 AM To: After Effects Mail List Subject: Re: [AE] F*k You Adobe Is Premiere being used for long-form documentary and Feature work? I assume= so, I hear people talk about it now and again on the internet, but I've ne= ver actually met anyone who uses it on larger more intensive projects. In f= act I don't know any editors locally who use it for professional work at al= l. Is it ever used for Broadcast work? Are there any drawbacks at this point compared to AVID or FCP? I'd love to = hear from someone who has used Premiere and FCP/AVID on larger projects, ra= ther than someone who has only used Premiere. I got called in about a month ago to finish up a short 3 minute corporate p= iece started by a communications manager. Seemed quite stable and snappy co= mpared to my minor foray's into Premiere in years past. Thanks, James On Feb 8, 2012, at 7:49 AM, John Morgan wrote: There was that historical thing with Premiere. Random crashes, occasional (= seldom) corruption entering into the project bringing the need to import th= e corrupt project into a new project, or having to cut/paste contents from = a corrupt sequence into another.....saving the project to a new filename. = I've seen all that stuff in the 9 years I've used it. It's gone now. It's been gone since the move to 64-bit....since CS5. Always= good to look at the historical perspective, but don't let history cripple = you. Taking the lid off RAM usage, making systems scalable, Adobe's intelli= gent memory manager, CUDA GPU processes, all come together to make Premiere= a truly high-end stable editing platform. John From: After Effects Mail List [mailto:AE-List@media-motion.tv] On Behalf Of= Glenn Ferguson Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2012 8:29 AM To: After Effects Mail List Subject: Re: [AE] F*k You Adobe Could you please elaborate on that statement? From: brand standard Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2012 8:40 AM To: After Effects Mail List Subject: Re: [AE] F*k You Adobe historically, adobe has always seemed vulnerable to corruption. it's the = one thing that keeps me away from premiere. ________________________________ From: joe cafe > To: After Effects Mail List > Sent: Wednesday, February 8, 2012 6:55 AM Subject: Re: [AE] F*k You Adobe I've had no problems with my ppc browser. Once again, for 99% of the population, the needs of the family has priority= over spending thousands for new hardware to watch Flash movs on the web. If you want video to be seen by everybody, Flash is best avoided. On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 5:09 AM, Tony Hayes > wrote: if Joe had a 6-7 year old PC he'd have no problems installing the latest ve= rsion of flash. This message, and any attachments, is intended only for the use of the addr= essee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential or ot= herwise exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this = e-mail is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any unau= thorized use, dissemination, distribution or reproduction of this message i= s prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please noti= fy the sender by return e-mail and delete this e-mail and any attachments f= rom your system.=20=20 This message, and any attachments, is intended only for the use of the addr= essee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential or ot= herwise exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this= e-mail is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any una= uthorized use, dissemination, distribution or reproduction of this message = is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please no= tify the sender by return e-mail and delete this e-mail and any attachments= from your system.= --_000_EAE675A223415848A14AA69EBCDE9D0A5913843BF8EXCHslccint_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Sorry for= my snarkiness. J As I understand, FCPX still doesn’t = work with native file types and still forces background rendering because o= f commitment to a proprietary codec. I watched the roll-out demo on YouTube= , specifically looking for those things and didn’t see them.  My= longest project rarely exceeds 30 mins so according to your definition I&#= 8217;m not qualified to answer. But I DO use Pr on an HP Z800 box with dual= quad-core Xeon i7’s which net 16 processor cores in hyperthreaded mo= de, and Pr/Ae/En/AME use all 16 at between 70% and 100%, depending on the t= ype of function underway. I do have a Quadro FX 4800 CUDA card and I do hav= e a 16-drive (RAID 5) Rorke Data Galaxy HDX2 (via 4Gb fiber channel) attach= ed, and a  Matrox MXO2LE system for HD overlay on an external monitor.= This system can playback more than 20 layers of native P2 or Sony .mxf vid= eo, effects, Ae exports and FX in real time without pre-rendering the timel= ine.  The system is rock solid and I would trust it all the way across= Australia for any length of project. Currently using Pr 5.5.2.<= /span>

 

No FCP user has ever watched my 20-layer demo project a= nd gone away telling me his pixels are better. (An old personal joke dating= back to the mac vs pc wars of the ‘90s.)

John

 

From:= After E= ffects Mail List [mailto:AE-List@media-motion.tv] On Behalf Of James= Culbertson
Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2012 1:06 PM
To:<= /b> After Effects Mail List
Subject: Re: [AE] F*k You Adobe<= /o:p>

 

=

Your description of Premiere could be confused with a = description of FCPX ...my point being that just throwing out a bunch of spe= cs doesn't guarantee an app is ready for the most intensive projects in the= real world.

 

Again, I assume it is ready for these = type of projects. I just had not heard any reports from the trenches from e= ditors who also use AVID/FCP7 on a daily basis.

 

Wou= ld you buy/rent a vehicle for a drive across the Australian outback based p= urely on a car makers specs, or would you want to talk to folks who have al= ready made the drive?

&n= bsp;

James

 

 

On Feb 8, 2012, at 11:49 AM= , John Morgan wrote:



=

Nah, nobody would use it fo= r professional or broadcast work, what with its scalable 64-bit architectur= e (meaning throw all the RAM and processors you can afford at it), ability = to work natively with all professional camera (and many pro-sumer) codecs a= nd file types, ability to hand off GPU processing to CUDA-approved cards, a= bility to manage differing pixel aspects and framerates on the same timelin= e…..and all of this in a nearly render-free (for timeline playback) e= nvironment.

&nb= sp;

John=

 

<= p class=3DMsoNormal>From: Afte= r Effects Mail List [mailto:AE-List@media-motion.tv] On Behalf Of James Culbertson
Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2012 11:56 AM
To: After Effects Mail ListSubject: Re: [AE] = F*k You Adobe

 

Is Premiere b= eing used for long-form documentary and Feature work? I assume so, I hear p= eople talk about it now and again on the internet, but I've never actually = met anyone who uses it on larger more intensive projects. In fact I don't k= now any editors locally who use it for professional work at all.=

 

<= /div>

Is it ever used for Broadcast work?

 

=

Are there any drawbacks at this = point compared to AVID or FCP? I'd love to hear from someone who has used P= remiere and FCP/AVID on larger projects, rather than someone who has only u= sed Premiere.

&nbs= p;

I got called in= about a month ago to finish up a short 3 minute corporate piece started by= a communications manager. Seemed quite stable and snappy compared to my mi= nor foray's into Premiere in years past.

 

Thanks,

 

James

 

 

On Feb 8, 2012, at 7:49 AM, John Morgan wrote:




<= /p>

There was that historic= al thing with Premiere. Random crashes, occasional (seldom) corruption ente= ring into the project bringing the need to import the corrupt project into = a new project, or having to cut/paste contents from a corrupt sequence into= another…..saving the project to a new filename.  I’ve see= n all that stuff in the 9 years I’ve used it.

 

It’s gone now. It&= #8217;s been gone since the move to 64-bit….since CS5. Always good to= look at the historical perspective, but don’t let history cripple yo= u. Taking the lid off RAM usage, making systems scalable, Adobe’s int= elligent memory manager, CUDA GPU processes, all come together to make Prem= iere a truly high-end stable editing platform.

<= /div>

 

John

 

=

From: After Effects Mail List [mailt= o:AE-List@media-motion.tv] = On Behalf Of Glenn F= erguson
Sent: Wed= nesday, February 08, 2012 8:29 AM
To: After Effects Mail List
Subject: Re: [AE] F*k You Adobe

 

Could you please elaborate on that statemen= t?

=  

<= b>Sent:<= /span> Wednesday, February 08, 2= 012 8:40 AM

Subject: Re: [AE] F*k Yo= u Adobe

<= p class=3DMsoNormal> 

historically, adobe has always seemed vulnerable to corrupti= on.   it's the one thing that keeps me away from premiere.

From:=  joe cafe <cafe.joe@gmail.com= >
To: After Ef= fects Mail List <AE-List@medi= a-motion.tv> 
= Sent: Wednesday, Februa= ry 8, 2012 6:55 AM
Subject:&n= bsp;Re: [AE] F*k You Adobe

 

I've had n= o problems with my ppc browser.

Once again, for 99% of the population= , the needs of the family has priority over spending thousands for new hard= ware to watch Flash movs on the web.

<= div>

If you want video to be seen by everybody, Fl= ash is best avoided.

 

On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 5:09 AM, Tony Hayes <tony@cleverbits.com&g= t; wrote:

if Joe had a 6-7 year old PC he'd have no probl= ems installing the latest version of flash.

 

 


This mes= sage, and any attachments, is intended only for the use of the addressee an= d may contain information that is privileged and confidential or otherwise = exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this e-mail i= s not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any unauthorized= use, dissemination, distribution or reproduction of this message is prohib= ited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the s= ender by return e-mail and delete this e-mail and any attachments from your= system.  ­­  

 

 

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