Return-Path: Received: from p3plsmtpa06-02.prod.phx3.secureserver.net ([173.201.192.103] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.10) with ESMTP id 4753829 for ae-list@media-motion.tv; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 18:28:10 +0200 Received: from [192.168.0.101] ([173.247.4.230]) by p3plsmtpa06-02.prod.phx3.secureserver.net with id R4X31j0034xm879014X5mZ; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 09:31:06 -0700 Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2012 12:31:03 -0400 From: Greg Balint To: After Effects Mail List Message-ID: <9928BD228C3F421E9D15711D03836644@delrazor.com> In-Reply-To: <6E97A0A4E48A4D008EF24538B9737103@delrazor.com> References: <6E97A0A4E48A4D008EF24538B9737103@delrazor.com> Subject: Re: [AE] contracts, slightly OT X-Mailer: sparrow 1.2 (build 479.2) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="4fe34c66_737b8ddc_a26" --4fe34c66_737b8ddc_a26 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Sorry. Accidentally hit send. =20 Basically. , =22are you planning on not paying me on time=3F Why would yo= u have a problem with this clause then=3F=22 Do you think if you decided to not pay the power company until =22you wan= ted to=22 that they'd continue to give you their service out of =22Respec= t for being able to work with you=22=3F And leave your lights on until yo= u felt ok to pay them=3F Why would my services be any different=3F This clause, and watermarks on everything until final payment is received= is sometimes what is needed for brand new clients, or ones you cannot tr= ust. =20 /////Greg Balint ///Art Director / Motion Designer /321/514/4839 delRAZOR.com/ On Thursday, June 21, 2012 at 12:25 PM, Greg Balint wrote: > This has also been my experience. The larger the company, the slower t= he pay, but the larger the budget. =20 > =20 > The problem with smaller clients, is that they sometimes don't have the= money in their own accounts to pay ME when the work is done, so they hav= e to wait for their client to pay them before I get paid. Sometimes taki= ng up to 2+ months. =20 > =20 > I actually have a clause in my contract that states this. =20 > =20 > =22Payment is due within 30 days of invoice creation (NET30). If paymen= t is not received within this period, a fee will be assessed of 5% of the= invoice price for each DAY payment is late. This fee will be added to th= e current invoice and is due immediately with the delinquent payment.=22 > =20 > Normally my clients have no issues with this clause in the contract. I= f they raise question to it, my only response is this. =20 > =20 > =22If I didn't deliver the time sensitive work you needed on time, due = to my own choice, don't you think you'd be frustrated about that=3F Would= n't you feel like you should have some sort of action in place in case I = don't deliver=3F Like. =22we don't have to pay you as much.=22=3F > =20 > Do you think if you decided to not pay the power company until =22you w= anted to=22 that they'd continue to give you their service out of =22 > =20 > =20 > /////Greg Balint > ///Art Director / Motion Designer > /321/514/4839 > delRAZOR.com/ > =20 > =20 > On Thursday, June 21, 2012 at 11:48 AM, Teddy Gage wrote: > =20 > > In my experience I often find the largest companies are the slowest t= o pay. I have heard from people on the inside it is something of a compan= y policy to delay freelance invoices so the budgets looks better. Additio= nally, if you're not =22in the system=22 yet there's always some lazy bod= y in accounting who forgets to include you in that pay cycle. I find smal= ler places it's easier to get paid quickly because of the personal connec= tion. However I would agree there's more risk of a small place never payi= ng at all. And like jim said I usually go hourly first or demand half up = front when the bid is accepted. Unless I have grave misgivings or its a h= uge project I usually don't bother with a contract. Risky, but 90% of my = business is done with a handshake... I worry places would be put off if i= t came to that. I work regularly in nyc, maybe things are different in LA= etc > > On Jun 21, 2012 11:33 AM, =22Jim Curtis=22 wrote: > > > I have different kinds of clients. Some are small production compa= nies and agencies. Some huge corporations and non-profits. The latter o= nes make me sign their PSA, and I always get paid on their schedule. It'= s the small agencies who are the worst, and the most likely to either nic= kel-and-dime me, take forever to pay, or dock my invoice for some imagine= d shortcoming. > > > =20 > > > I wish I could hold onto masters as a lien/security, but most proje= cts are time-sensitive, and that's seldom possible or practical. > > > =20 > > > When I was in production, and on the hook for payments for film, fr= eelancers, meals, travel, etc., I demanded =E2=85=93 up front, =E2=85=93 = upon completion of production, and balance upon delivery of master, spell= ed out in a written agreement. > > > =20 > > > But, now I'm strictly post. I do have a standard spiel for new cli= ents: I charge by the hour until a working relationship is established, = so I know what I'm getting into in terms of client involvement and workin= g methods. If they demand a bid, I tell them up front, I'm going to bid = double what I think the job will really require, to try to prevent workin= g for half price. > > > =20 > > > Nothing is written. It says on my invoice that =22Payment is due u= pon receipt=22 (although many of them ignore this, and pay me after they = get paid). > > > =20 > > > I haven't been shafted since I cut an independent short for a so-ca= lled =22friend.=22 > > > =20 > > > =20 > > > =20 > > > On Jun 21, 2012, at 8:28 AM, henry birdseye wrote: > > > =20 > > > > After reading the absolutely horrifying stories on The World's Lo= ngest Invoice (http://worldslongestinvoice.tumblr.com/), I'm highly motiv= ated to require a contract with new customers. > > > > > > > > How many of you are using contracts and do you have an example of= one that pertains directly to motion graphic work=3F > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > +---End of message---+ > > > > To unsubscribe send any message to > > > =20 > > > =20 > > > +---End of message---+ > > > To unsubscribe send any message to > =20 --4fe34c66_737b8ddc_a26 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Sorry. Accidentally hit send. 

Basically. , =22are you planning on not paying me on time=3F Why w= ould you have a problem with this clause then=3F=22

Do you think if you= decided to not pay the power company until =22you wanted to=22 that they= 'd continue to give you their service out of =22Respect for being able to= work with you=22=3F And leave your lights on until you felt ok to pay th= em=3F

Why would my services be any different=3F


This clause, and watermarks on everything until final pa= yment is received is sometimes what is needed for brand new clients, or o= nes you cannot trust. 


/////= Greg Balint
///Art Director / Motion Designer
/321/514/4839
delR= AZOR.com/

=20

On Thursday, June 21, 2012 at 12:2= 5 PM, Greg Balint wrote:

This has also been my experience.  The larger the company, t= he slower the pay, but the larger the budget.  

The problem with smaller clients, is that they sometimes don't hav= e the money in their own accounts to pay ME when the work is done, so the= y have to wait for their client to pay them before I get paid.  Some= times taking up to 2+ months. 
I actually have a clause in my cont= ract that states this. 

=22Payment is due within 30 days of invoic= e creation (NET30). If payment is not received within this period, a fee = will be assessed of 5% of the invoice price for each DAY payment is late.= This fee will be added to the current invoice and is due immediately wit= h the delinquent payment.=22

Normally my clients have no issues with th= is clause in the contract.  If they raise question to it, my only re= sponse is this. 

=22If I didn't deliver the time sensitive work yo= u needed on time, due to my own choice, don't you think you'd be frustrat= ed about that=3F Wouldn't you feel like you should have some sort of acti= on in place in case I don't deliver=3F  Like. =22we don't have to pa= y you as much.=22=3F

Do you think if you decided to not pay the power c= ompany until =22you wanted to=22 that they'd continue to give you their s= ervice out of =22


/////Greg Balint
///Art Director / Motion Designer
/321/514= /4839
delRAZOR.com/

=20

On Thursday, June 21, 2012 at 11:4= 8 AM, Teddy Gage wrote:

In my experience I= often find the largest companies are the slowest to pay. I have heard fr= om people on the inside it is something of a company policy to delay free= lance invoices so the budgets looks better. Additionally, if you're not =22= in the system=22 yet there's always some lazy body in accounting who forg= ets to include you in that pay cycle. I find smaller places it's easier t= o get paid quickly because of the personal connection. However I would ag= ree there's more risk of a small place never paying at all. And like jim = said I usually go hourly first or demand half up front when the bid is ac= cepted. Unless I have grave misgivings or its a huge project I usually do= n't bother with a contract. Risky, but 90% of my business is done with a = handshake... I worry places would be put off if it came to that. I work r= egularly in nyc, maybe things are different in LA etc

On Jun 21, 2012 11:33 AM, =22Jim Curtis=22 <jpcurtis=40me.com> wrote:
I have different kinds of clients.  Some are small production compan= ies and agencies.  Some huge corporations and non-profits.  The= latter ones make me sign their PSA, and I always get paid on their sched= ule.  It's the small agencies who are the worst, and the most likely= to either nickel-and-dime me, take forever to pay, or dock my invoice fo= r some imagined shortcoming.

I wish I could hold onto masters as a lien/security, but most projects ar= e time-sensitive, and that's seldom possible or practical.

When I was in production, and on the hook for payments for film, freelanc= ers, meals, travel, etc., I demanded =E2=85=93 up front, =E2=85=93 upon c= ompletion of production, and balance upon delivery of master, spelled out= in a written agreement.

But, now I'm strictly post.  I do have a standard spiel for new clie= nts:  I charge by the hour until a working relationship is establish= ed, so I know what I'm getting into in terms of client involvement and wo= rking methods.  If they demand a bid, I tell them up front, I'm goin= g to bid double what I think the job will really require, to try to preve= nt working for half price.

Nothing is written.  It says on my invoice that =22Payment is due up= on receipt=22 (although many of them ignore this, and pay me after they g= et paid).

I haven't been shafted since I cut an independent short for a so-called =22= friend.=22



On Jun 21, 2012, at 8:28 AM, henry birdseye wrote:

> After reading the absolutely horrifying stories on The World's Longe= st Invoice (http://worldslongestinvoice.tumblr.com/), I'm high= ly motivated to require a contract with new customers.
>
> How many of you are using contracts and do you have an example of on= e that pertains directly to motion graphic work=3F
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
>
>
> +---End of message---+
> To unsubscribe send any message to <ae-list-off=40media-motion.tv>


+---End of message---+
To unsubscribe send any message to <ae-list-off=40media-motion.tv>
=20 =20 =20 =20

=20 =20 =20 =20
=20

--4fe34c66_737b8ddc_a26--