Return-Path: Received: from atl4mhob07.myregisteredsite.com ([209.17.115.45] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.10) with ESMTP id 4867500 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Tue, 09 Oct 2012 16:06:40 +0200 Received: from mailpod.hostingplatform.com (mail.networksolutionsemail.com [205.178.146.50]) by atl4mhob07.myregisteredsite.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id q99E8kjo011363 for ; Tue, 9 Oct 2012 10:08:46 -0400 Received: (qmail 13262 invoked by uid 0); 9 Oct 2012 14:08:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.0.3?) (dsd@darkskydigital.com@24) by 0 with ESMTPA; 9 Oct 2012 14:08:46 -0000 From: Dann Stubbs Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-71--30145404 Subject: Re: [AE] The best ergonomic input device is... Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2012 10:08:45 -0400 In-Reply-To: To: "After Effects Mail List" References: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) --Apple-Mail-71--30145404 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 the people in my office who never seemed to suffer from any of this = repetitive stress things were the smokers. they were frequently getting up and walking outside for smoke breaks. there is always a silver lining somewhere... ___________________________________________________________________ Dann Stubbs - dann@darkskydigital.com Dark Sky Digital - http://www.darkskydigital.com http://www.RenderKing.com Value Priced C4D, VRAY Render Farm ___________________________________________________________________ On Oct 9, 2012, at 9:59 AM, Brian Maffitt wrote: > It's funny, I'm exactly the opposite. Something about having to grip = the stylus makes my hand cramp up after a short period of time. And a = trackball was never precise enough for my me.=20 >=20 > When I do get sore from too much mouse usage, as Jim said, I change = the height of my chair arms and in a worst case, add a pillow, and I'm = fine by the next day. I love tablets for painting, but not for general = input. >=20 > And as Jim also said, your mileage may vary. Everybody is different; = find what works for you. >=20 > Brian >=20 >> Great OT thread. In a field like ours, ergonomics is paramount. It is = totally possible and likely that you will injure yourself out of a job = with the wrong practices. I concur with Jim that a tablet is a great = mouse replacement. I can't use a mouse for more than a few minutes a day = without irritation. I can use a tablet all day and feel fine. Thanks for = the link to the Leap Motion. That looks awesome. =20 >>=20 >> How well does a stand up desk work when using a tablet? I'm = considering raising my desk to stand and get a tall chair for times when = I need to sit.=20 >>=20 >> On Tue, Oct 9, 2012 at 6:19 AM, Angie-Taylor = wrote: >> I agree with Jim, switching is good. I eventually found a great chair = after trying all sorts of expensive chairs and it's like having 3 chairs = in one. Everything is adjustable to I just adjust it slightly whenever I = get strain or tiredness. I have the base on a "free-float mechanism so = it moves as I move. Then i adjust armrests and back angle when I need = to.=20 >>=20 >> http://www.rhchairs.co.uk/office-chairs/rh-activ/ >>=20 >> I've had it for about 8 years and still love it. >>=20 >> On my desk i have a small A5 Wacom, a Microsoft wireless mouse and a = traditional Apple mouse, I switch between all three. I also have a Space = Navigator and the buttons on my Wacom tablet which I program. I very = rarely use gestural stuff, i find it too unreliable. >>=20 >> Cheers, >>=20 >> Angie >>=20 >>=20 >> On 9 Oct 2012, at 09:36, Jim Tierney wrote: >>=20 >>> Regarding the joystick, awhile back when I was running the Bay Area = Motion Graphics group we got a variety of vendors to give us a variety = of devices and had folks test them. >>> =20 >>> The joystick was one of the devices that stood out=85 sort of. We = bought a few of them here at Digital Anarchy and ultimately stopped = using them. Less stress on the wrist, but it puts a lot of stress on = your arm/shoulder. An improvement, but ultimately it just moves the = stress to a different area. >>> =20 >>> Patrick, I disagree with Shelby=92s advice regarding devices. I = don=92t think there is such a thing as a good mouse or trackpad when it = comes to RSI. Tablets when positioned and used correctly are the only = thing I=92ve found to really help with my RSI problems. Whenever I = switch back to a mouse or have to use trackpad on laptop it becomes a = problem. In terms of preventing RSI, switching devices is probably = better than doing nothing, but once you have serious RSI problems it = becomes very clear what devices help and which aggravate it. >>> =20 >>> I realize everyone=92s mileage will vary=85 but once you get used = to a tablet as a mouse replacement (NOT as a paint tool) and get a = proper chair/workstation setup, it=92s amazing the difference it makes. = Part of the trick is having adjustable arms on the chair (I=92ve got a = Steelcase chair which is great), so that your arm is lightly resting on = the arm of the chair while you=92re using the tablet and you can = configure things so you can sit upright and not have to extend your arm. >>> =20 >>> I use a Wacom 4x6 for my 1920x1080 monitor. This is not great as a = paint tablet for that size monitor, but as a mouse replacement it kicks = ass. I also LOVE the Microsoft Natural Ergonomic 4000 keyboard. = Excellent keyboard. >>> =20 >>> If you don=92t have the space to have 3 desks and 3 types of chairs, = getting up and stretching frequently is extremely helpful. So yeah, = changing your position frequently is a great idea, but that can be done = through stretching as well as different types of workstations. Yoga and = learning how to stretch properly will help considerably. >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> Cheers, >>> Jim >>> ---------------=20 >>> Jim Tierney >>> President >>> Digital Anarchy >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> From: After Effects Mail List [mailto:AE-List@media-motion.tv] On = Behalf Of patrick siemer >>> Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 8:04 PM >>> To: After Effects Mail List >>> Subject: [AE] The best ergonomic input device is... >>> =20 >>> ...The next device you use. just don't use it for long. >>> For some time at Pixar we had a full-time Ergonomics expert named = Shelby.=20 >>> She was so good at her job, she actually worked her way out of a = job. >>> Essentially, she had one Mantra about Ergonomics and preventing = Repetitive Stress Injury. =20 >>> "The Best Position is your next Position." >>> Everybody always wanted to know the best way to sit, the best mouse = to use, the best tablet, trackball, chair, Lifting desk, standing desk, = Yoga ball, etc. >>> Her answer was always the same, "All of them, and switch them = often." >>> She encouraged people to sit however they wanted, but to change = positions, chairs and input devices often. As often as Possible, Many = times a day. >>> I had begun to experience a numbness in my mousing arm, but that = little bit of info saved my arm forever. >>> I learned to use a Yoga Ball sometimes, a Swopper stool sometimes, a = Freedom chair sometimes, and with the awesome Electro-Lifting desk,=20 >>> i could switch from sitting to standing with the push of a button. >>> Repetitive stress Injuries happen when you keep doing the same thing = over and over. >>> She taught the common-sense lesson "If your body is hurting from = doing something, Stop doing it." >>> If you switch things around enough, you'll never get to the Injury = hurting part. =20 >>> To service that advice, her office was like an ergonomic birthday = party for everyone who entered. >>> Every input device known to man, available for any worker who was = interested, to just take back to their office and get back to work In = Another Position. >>> When I mentioned that my arm was tingling, I had an electric desk = the next day. >>> It might sound excessive, but It wasn't just to coddle the artists, = preventing disabling injuries is just good business >>> =20 >>> Plus, Electric Lifting Desks are the most badass desks ever.=20 >>> I will always use one, as long as I have to look at a screen at work = or home. >>> =20 >>> Oh yeah, My Next Device is this little gadget, you can pre-order = now.... >>> =20 >>> https://leapmotion.com/ >>> =20 >>> finally!=20 >>> =20 >>> patrick siemer >>> tapeandglue.com >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> On Oct 8, 2012, at 11:58 AM, Phil Spitler wrote: >>> Continuing on the thread of input devices.... >>> =20 >>> Anybody use a joystick with AE and OSX. >>> =20 >>> We are looking something like this. >>> =20 >>> = http://www.amazon.com/3M-Ergonomic-Optical-Compatible-EM500GPS/dp/B00008KW= WG >>> =20 >>> Any thoughts? >>> =20 >>> Phil >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> Phil Spitler | Creative Technologist | Bonfire Labs | t : = 415.394.8200 m : 415.571.3139 >>>=20 >>> Website | Facebook | LinkedIn >>> =20 >>> =20 >>=20 >>=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail-71--30145404 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 the = people in my office who never seemed to suffer from any of this = repetitive stress things were the smokers.

they were = frequently getting up and walking outside for smoke = breaks.

there is always a silver lining = somewhere...

Dann = Stubbs  -  dann@darkskydigital.com
<= div style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; = margin-left: 0px; ">Dark Sky Digital -  http://www.darkskydigital.com

http://www.RenderKing.com &nbs= p;Value Priced C4D, VRAY Render Farm



On Oct 9, 2012, at 9:59 AM, Brian Maffitt wrote:

Great OT = thread. In a field like ours, ergonomics is paramount. It is totally = possible and likely that you will injure yourself out of a job with the = wrong practices. I concur with Jim that a tablet is a great mouse = replacement. I can't use a mouse for more than a few minutes a day = without irritation. I can use a tablet all day and feel fine. Thanks for = the link to the Leap Motion. That looks awesome.  

How well does a stand up desk work when using a tablet? = I'm considering raising my desk to stand and get a tall chair for times = when I need to sit. 

On Tue, Oct = 9, 2012 at 6:19 AM, Angie-Taylor <angie-taylor@ntlworld.com> wrote:
I agree with Jim, switching is good. I = eventually found a great chair after trying all sorts of expensive = chairs and it's like having 3 chairs in one. Everything is adjustable to = I just adjust it slightly whenever I get strain or tiredness. I have the = base on a "free-float mechanism so it moves as I move. Then i adjust = armrests and back angle when I need to. 

http://www.rhchairs.co.uk/office-chairs/rh-activ/

I've had it for about 8 years and still love = it.

On my desk i have a small A5 Wacom, a Microsoft = wireless mouse and a traditional Apple mouse, I switch between all = three. I also have a Space Navigator and the buttons on my Wacom tablet = which I program. I very rarely use gestural stuff, i find it too = unreliable.
=

Cheers,

Angie


On 9 Oct 2012, = at 09:36, Jim Tierney wrote:

Regarding the joystick, awhile back when I was running the Bay Area = Motion Graphics group we got a variety of vendors to give us a variety = of devices and had folks test them.
 
The joystick was one of the devices that stood out=85 sort of. We = bought a few of them here at Digital Anarchy and ultimately stopped = using them. Less stress on the wrist, but it puts a lot of stress on = your arm/shoulder. An improvement, but ultimately it just moves the = stress to a different area.
 
Patrick, I disagree with Shelby=92s advice regarding devices. I don=92t= think there is such a thing as a good mouse or trackpad when it comes = to RSI. Tablets when positioned and used correctly are the only thing = I=92ve found to really help with my RSI problems. Whenever I switch back = to a mouse or have to use trackpad on laptop it becomes a problem. In = terms of preventing RSI, switching devices is probably better than doing = nothing, but once you have serious RSI problems it becomes very clear = what devices help and which aggravate it.
 
I realize everyone=92s mileage will vary=85 but  once you get = used to a tablet as a mouse replacement (NOT as a paint tool) and get a = proper chair/workstation setup, it=92s amazing the difference it makes. = Part of the trick is having adjustable arms on the chair (I=92ve got a = Steelcase chair which is great), so that your arm is lightly resting on = the arm of the chair while you=92re using the tablet and you can = configure things so you can sit upright and not have to extend your = arm.
 
I use a Wacom 4x6 for my 1920x1080 monitor. This is not great as a = paint tablet for that size monitor, but as a mouse replacement it kicks = ass. I also LOVE the Microsoft  Natural Ergonomic 4000 keyboard. = Excellent keyboard.
 
If you don=92t have the space to have 3 desks and 3 types of chairs, = getting up and stretching frequently is extremely helpful. So yeah, = changing your position frequently is a great idea, but that can be done = through stretching as well as different types of workstations. Yoga and = learning how to stretch properly will help = considerably.
 
 
Cheers,
Jim
--------------- 
Jim Tierney
President
Digital Anarchy
 
 
 
 
From: = After Effects Mail List [mailto:AE-List@media-motion.tv] On = Behalf Of patrick siemer
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 8:04 = PM
To: After Effects Mail = List
Subject: [AE] The best ergonomic input = device is...
 
...The next device you use. just don't use it for = long.
For some time at  Pixar we had a full-time Ergonomics expert named = Shelby. 
She was so good at her job, she actually worked her way out of a = job.
Essentially, she had one Mantra about Ergonomics and preventing = Repetitive Stress Injury.  
"The Best Position is your next = Position."
Everybody always wanted to know the best way to sit, the best mouse to = use, the best tablet, trackball, chair, Lifting desk, standing desk, = Yoga ball, etc.
Her answer was always the same,  "All of them, and switch them = often."
She encouraged people to sit however they wanted, but to change = positions, chairs and input devices often. As often as Possible, Many = times a day.
I had begun to experience a numbness in my mousing arm, but that little = bit of info saved my arm forever.
I learned to use a Yoga Ball sometimes, a Swopper stool sometimes, a = Freedom chair sometimes, and with the awesome Electro-Lifting = desk, 
i could switch from sitting to standing with the push of a = button.
Repetitive stress Injuries happen when you keep doing the same thing = over and over.
She taught the common-sense lesson "If your body is hurting from doing = something, Stop doing it."
If you switch things around enough, you'll never get to the Injury = hurting part.  
To service that advice, her office was like an ergonomic birthday party = for everyone who entered.
Every input device known to man, available for any worker who was = interested, to just take back to their office and get back to work =  In Another Position.
When I mentioned that my arm was tingling, I had an electric desk the = next day.
It might sound excessive, but It wasn't just to coddle the artists, = preventing disabling injuries is just good = business
 
Plus, Electric = Lifting Desks are the most badass desks ever. 
I will always = use one, as long as I have to look at a screen at work or = home.
 
Oh yeah, My Next Device is this little gadget, you can pre-order = now....
 
 
finally! 
 
patrick siemer
 
 
 
On Oct 8, 2012, at 11:58 AM, Phil Spitler = wrote:
Continuing on the thread of input = devices....
 
Anybody use a = joystick with AE and OSX.
 
We are looking something like this.
 
 
Any thoughts?
 
Phil
 
 
 
Phil Spitler  = |  Creative Technologist   = |  Bonfire Labs  |  t : 415.394.8200  m : 415.571.3139

Website | Facebook | LinkedIn
 
=  

<= /div>



= --Apple-Mail-71--30145404--