----- Original Message -----

From: Teddy Gage

To: After Effects Mail List

Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2012 1:12 PM

Subject: Re: [AE] Arri flat

OK that helps. That's sort of what I was doing already- but I'd really like to avoid having to work on the effects directly in c-log, it's gonna be a huge headache with color space conversion and preview. I was thinking maybe a round trip through dnxHD 10-bit may be the answer. The final deliverables are going to be HD5 for broadcast as far as I can tell, and maybe a DCP. Looks like I need to have another conversation with the director and online editor to figure out this workflow and how they're doing the color correct. I wish they'd just shot dnxhd in the first place...
-TG

On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 12:58 PM, Jim Curtis <jpcurtis@me.com> wrote:

I touched on this already, but what I've done is to put a first instance of levels on the clips or an adjustment layer to get the levels on a WFM in the ballpark of 1-100.  Then, I add a second instance of other plugs (I like Frishchluft FL Curves best) for fine tuning.

What you render to depends on where you're going.  I was doing broadcast spots, so I rendered to ProRes422 (in RGB color space) and made MPEG2 for distribution via DG and ExtremeReach from those.

To be honest, I don't know if that's a great method, but the footage looks great, and I love the expanded dynamic range and the minimizing of clipping in the whites that I often see with lesser capture formats.  

Monitoring:  I have a calibrated HP DreamColor display and a Sony Trinitron CRT hooked up to a Kona for accurate monitoring.  I use an Apple Cinema Display for my computer monitor, and I can attest that the images are vastly different between the computer display and the broadcast monitors.  What looks right on the broadcast monitors is super-saturated on the ACD (using the default Cinema HD Apple profile - not flat).  

You can check yourself by looking at the scopes in Ae bundled Color Finesse, if you don't have any other scopes available.  Or, you can check your work by using the scopes in Pr, if you have that.  I run Synthetic Apps Test Gear full-time in Ae.

I'm sure you're aware that home HDTVs have picture settings that alter the contrast, saturation, etc.  Whether your HDTV gives you an accurate look depends on many settings and the hardware feeding your HDMI signal.  But, if that's all you have, then see if your output compares favorably to what you watch on TV.  If it looks right, maybe it is right.

On Nov 25, 2012, at 11:26 AM, Teddy Gage wrote:

ok looks like it is 4444, 276 mbps. I wasn't aware the arri encoded directly to prores so that solves one problem, namely what I thought was a bad transcode. Looks like these clips are direct from camera.

Now what's the best way for this footage to make the round trip, FX-wise, without destroying the integrity of the 10bit 4444? I'm thinking:

- convert to log c color space / 32bpc to work in. Match all FX footage / roto / stock elements to the log c preview?
- render back out to lossless QTs in 10bit YUV from AE
- do I render in video color space or should I render out in the log c profile?

I don't have an HD monitor, I have a high-end "graphics" monitor (the eizo CG222, extremely flat response, color accurate, 99%+ of adobe RGB) but to get an accurate final preview I may throw it onto my HDTV (not ideal, I know, but at least should give me an idea what I'm looking at, right?)

Any other tips / gotchas would be greatly appreciated.
-TG

On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 10:53 AM, Jim Curtis <jpcurtis@me.com> wrote:

You can tell if it's 422 or 4444 by looking at the clip info in the Ae Project pane, or by using Get Info in QT Player.

The Alexa footage I've worked with (just three projects, so I'm no expert), the camera was connected to a cinedeck via 2 BNC cables, and the native footage was ProRes4444+, or IOW, no transcoding was done or necessary.  

If it was recorded to ArriRaw and transcoded with settings "baked," you have been robbed of the post-production benefits of recording in RAW.

On Nov 25, 2012, at 9:40 AM, Teddy Gage wrote:

OK so j. Penzer said the arri is using log c color space. This is the answer I was looking for. Here's my concern. I am ingesting prores transcodes, not the original camera files. The histogram for this footage in 32bpc is compressed on both sides and very clipped in the middle
a) I am concerned the editor didn't do the transcodes properly. I'm not even sure whether they were converted to 8 bit 4:2:2 or 10bit 4:4:4. I am, unfortunately, one of the more tech savvy people on production. Is there any way to figure this out?

B) how should I handle final  outputs? Should I use color space conversion back to log c on export so it's consistent in fcp? Does fcp do this conversion automatically? 

Thanks!

--
Animator & Editor
www.teddygage.com
Brooklyn

--
Animator & Editor
www.teddygage.com
Brooklyn