Mailing List AE-List@media-motion.tv ? Message #46886
From: Robert Kjettrup <robert@stvmayday.dk>
Subject: Re: [AE] Decklink extreme 3D rampreview support + SDI monitors
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2012 21:07:18 +0100
To: After Effects Mail List <AE-List@media-motion.tv>
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Hi

Just an update on this subject:

My Z820 just arrived here last week, and now i have it setup with a decklink card and a FSi monitor (it is as good as you said Carey :-))
And with this setup i can preview 16bit and 32bit HD AE rampreviews in realtime out to the FSi, so far so good. But i see horrible banding of ramps out of AE with the decklink, something i never saw with the old AJA card. Even the expected banding in 8bit out of the AJA looks better than the banding i get from the decklink in AE set to 16bit. It looks like a sawtooth banding pattern with a darkening at fixed interval, and not the "smooth" regular banding from the AJA. 
There is actually no difference in the output if set to 8, 16 or 32bit. They all band.
It is not the card that has a problem, because if outputting a 10bit sequence in Premiere it looks like it should, smooth. So either Blackmagic or Adobe should make some software changes to make this better :-(

Are any of you also seeing this?

- Robert



2012/9/27 Carey Dissmore <carey@imugonline.com>
You're welcome.

I just got an email from Flanders this morning (as paste from it is copied below). They have a new free firmware update for 12 bit support. I'll have to do this update in a few days as my current project load comes first. 

Carey

What's Been Added:
  • 12 bit RGB & YCbCr signal support & 12 bit processing*
  • Record Status Tally Feature. Allows the monitor to read Start/Stop Record Flags in the SDI ancillary data of compatible cameras and to indicate when the camera is recording by activating the monitor's red tally light. ARRI Alexa and Sony cameras with this feature enabled are currently supported.
  • New function button access to Log monitoring modes for faster single button press activation of Log monitoring modes introduced in the previous firmware release.
  • BETA support of 12 bit XYZ format signals* 
Current owners of FSI monitors can download the latest firmware from our update site http://www.flandersscientific.com/index/Firmware_Updates where more detailed release notes can also be found. An updated user manual is also available: http://www.flandersscientific.com/uploads/FSIUserManual.pdf

 

*12 bit signal support requires your monitor to be equipped with 3Gbps SDI inputs, which are provided as standard equipment on all current 9" and larger FSI Monitors. 

On Sep 27, 2012, at 5:00 AM, Robert Kjettrup <robert@stvmayday.dk> wrote:

Thanks for the feedback on AE output via the Decklink. That isn't very encouraging that you can't either playback 16/32bit rampreviews in realtime :-(
I have an aging HP XW8400 (the same generation hardware as the first macpro 8 cores) and i also suspect it is my hardware that might be the cause of the low framerate in 16bit projects when i have the SDI output active. Hopefully a new Z820 will do better, the memory bandwidth should be many times faster :-)
..or maybe there is a change needed in AE to do the conversion before sending it to the card, Mercury Transmit in After Effects?

I have send the link for your excellent review of the Flanders monitor to the relevant people here at the company.


Robert Kjettrup / Grafiker / Mayday Film
Mobil: 25 18 95 16
Mail: robert@maydayfilm.dk




2012/9/27 Carey Dissmore <carey@imugonline.com>
I run the Decklink HD Extreme 3D card on an older (but very upgraded) Mac Pro 3,1 along with a Quadro FX 4800 on displays and a Quadro 4000 on headless GPU grunt. I also run the EXCELLENT Flanders LM-2461W monitor on it.

In AE, the card displays 16 bit and 32 bit comps just fine, but on this output it you get choices of 8 bit, 10 bit or RGB. I choose RGB in 16 & 32bpc comps. 

RAM Preview: When I engage the hardware for RAM previews I get reduced frame rates. I think that is the fault of my Mac itself and not the card. That generates a lot more bus traffic to send the image out the card and I don't think this mac can handle it. In the next few weeks I am going to be building a new PC that should have substantially more horsepower and will be moving the BMD card and the Flanders to that new system so I can report back at that time. 

If you are interested, here's my review of the Flanders I did on my blog last spring:


All the best,
Carey


On Sep 26, 2012, at 2:53 PM, Robert Kjettrup <robert@stvmayday.dk> wrote:

Yes, thats the monitor we had for review, and it is looking really amazing. So good that i know of some who have dismissed it as being too good to evaluate what the picture would look like on a more "normal" screen :-D
But this PVM version doesn't have 3Gbps SDI or 4:4:4 input as the Flanders?
And the interlace processor is not that good on the PVM sony, not that this is a problem for me, but for others in our company it might be. We would like to standardise on one brand.
Do you have a problem with the OLED "flicker" on this model? some had an issue with this when we had the review monitor, some didn't see it. I didn't, might be because of me having gone past the 35th birthday :-)...getting older...

I would love to have this Sony monitor at my desk :-)


Robert Kjettrup / Grafiker / STV Mayday

Mobil: 25 18 95 16
Mail: robert@stvmayday.dk


2012/9/26 Brian Higgins <higgins@soldesignfx.com>
Sony PVM 24" OLEDs are amazing, and cost a only little more than the Flanders you mentioned.
http://pro.sony.com/bbsc/ssr/cat-monitors/cat-oledmonitors/product-PVM2541/

The features probably don't line up exactly with the Flanders, but at least take a look and see if it works for you.  The $1k/inch BVMs are the same panels with fancier processing on the back end to cover things like XYZ space for DI mastering that you might not need.  I've had a PVM on my desk for the last 6 months or so and have been very, very happy with it for broadcast work.

$.02,
Brian



On Wed, Sep 26, 2012 at 1:18 PM, Robert Kjettrup <robert@stvmayday.dk> wrote:
Hi

I am reseaching a bit on what SDI card to get for a new AE workstation, and don't get any positive answers from Blackmagic on what support the Decklink Extreme 3D has in After Effects and thought maybe some here on the list uses this card and could give some more detailed feedback.

Can this card play back rampreview from AE in realtime in 16 and 32bit projects to a SDI monitor? My current outdated legacy AJA card (KONA/XENA LH) cant playback 1080/25p 16bit projects in realtime and 32bit projects is just a bunch of scrambled mess on the SDI output. AJA gives some very vague feedback that this card is not supported anymore and the new cards are "updated", but nothing about the new cards being able to handle 16/32bit projects.

We are also about to change all our old trusty SD CRT Barco reference monitors to something more current (about time!) and i have suggested we should go with Flanders Sci. LM2461W. Is this also in here seen as the best vs. value monitor? 
We have had a Sony OLED monitor for review, and it is absolutely fantastic, but a bit pricy if you want the same options as the Flanders.
Does anyone have the TVlogic XVM series?

hope this is not too Off Topic for the list?


Robert Kjettrup / Grafiker / STV Mayday

Mobil: 25 18 95 16
Mail: robert@stvmayday.dk



--
brian higgins | creative director
Sol  Design








 
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