Return-Path: Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de ([212.227.17.9] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.10) with ESMTP-TLS id 4964357 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Fri, 01 Feb 2013 17:00:59 +0100 Received: from oxbaltgw10.schlund.de (oxbaltgw10.schlund.de [172.19.246.16]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mreu2) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0LjO9b-1UYRUx1P4x-00d0mg; Fri, 01 Feb 2013 17:06:44 +0100 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2013 17:06:44 +0100 (CET) From: "mylenium@mylenium.de" Reply-To: "mylenium@mylenium.de" To: After Effects Mail List Message-ID: <931753859.61496.1359734804326.JavaMail.open-xchange@email.1und1.de> In-Reply-To: References: Subject: Re: [AE] The History of Adobe After Effects MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_61495_2124214711.1359734804268" X-Priority: 3 Importance: Medium X-Mailer: Open-Xchange Mailer v- X-Provags-ID: V02:K0:LZo9RyUdA5mDWddltkI4+P2daqnWHwpGGS/L+57T01E GESVx/SWmpwb/Gftjd15ll5Uz9SqARwkLp7X8igmYHmIyb2DzL 5nMgnaq41M3MqqPzeWBc8W9Gposkn28YsX0kZGlfIrZ16HiGYZ +zGmOJ6aToy07GYmIBWgLVfQTxKC3fV9WfjswwY3zFCi15QTFq GoCGId9dS8Yw+UMSD9A+HNXEvfW4XoQwL3RNPJQfJAIc3WJj4F TJpEsJ88G86iMHmT9cmGzXyDPaa7EmiNli5ca+Rx+NyaMUFG2V u6NEKY598gdDYJmR56JhadaKoLKNiMhewnoWkBVJExbELrto23 bhWnBz3oR34ILd765C7KbldKNJEef7fI6p+1sypCfAtgPlhSym fVqibc8Q6inOphK2/36qIQZ1LttH1Z9EHA= ------=_Part_61495_2124214711.1359734804268 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Fair enough. Point taken. ;-) Mylenium [Pour Myl=C3=A8ne, ange sur terre] ----------------------------------------- www.mylenium.de Teddy Gage hat am 1. Februar 2013 um 17:05 geschriebe= n: > With all that "back in my day computers used punch cards and it took thre= e > hours to render a line" I thought for sure you were at least 70. Don't > criticize people for reminiscing then go all grumpy old men yourself, is = all > I'm saying... > :D >=20 > On Friday, February 1, 2013, mylenium@mylenium.de > wrote: > > > Whoa... Retirement at 38... Now that would be something... (Not= that > > > I would object with my health problems and all...) > >=20 > > Mylenium > >=20 > > [Pour Myl=C3=A8ne, ange sur terre] > > ----------------------------------------- > > www.mylenium.de > >=20 > > Teddy Gage < teddygage@gmail.com> hat am 1. Februar 2013 um 16:47 > > geschrieben: > >=20 > > > > > "When I started out as an 3d artist 19 years ago"... > > >=20 > > > You wouldn't happen to be typing this from the retirement home > > > computer, would you? > > >=20 > > > You're certainly grumpy enough to be a grandfather... > > >=20 > > > Sent from my iPad > > >=20 > > > On Feb 1, 2013, at 10:38 AM, " mylenium@mylenium.de" < > > > mylenium@mylenium.de> wrote: > > >=20 > > > > > > > I tend to see it from a different angle, comi= ng > > > > > > > from a 3D graphics background. I don't think anyone w= as > > > > > > > actually excluded in the past. People just take affor= dable > > > > > > > equipment or things like discounted education version= s for > > > > > > > granted these days, luxuries we never had. There wasn= 't > > > > > > > even something like Blender around when I started out= as > > > > > > > an 3D artist 19 years ago. And still, if you only wan= ted > > > > > > > hard enough you could somehow manage to buy your tool= s no > > > > > > > matter how expensive they may have been (not talking = about > > > > > > > a 50000 bucks SGI workstation and another 70000 bucks > > > > > > > Power Animator license, obviously; more like a 3000 b= ucks > > > > > > > Lightwave license). And instead of the annual upgrade > > > > > > > death spiral we have now, they got an update every 2 = years > > > > > > > and you actually had time to learn them and hone your > > > > > > > skills and save the money. It works in many ways, if = you > > > > > > > get my meaning.... And seeing how many people struggl= e > > > > > > > with even the simplest tutorials, I'm not sure if it'= s > > > > > > > just a "literacy" people can pick up or it produces m= ore > > > > > > > talent in any way... To me, it still comes down to th= is: > > > > > > > People, who can't draw a straight line with a pencil > > > > > > > probably shouldn't call themselves "motiongraphics > > > > > > > artist". Or in other words: I consider a classical > > > > > > > training/ education just as important or even more > > > > > > > important than just hacking around on the computer or > > > > > > > doing odd things with your digital camera.... > > > >=20 > > > > Mylenium > > > >=20 > > > > [Pour Myl=C3=A8ne, ange sur terre] > > > > ----------------------------------------- > > > > www.mylenium.de > > > >=20 > > > > James Culbertson < albion@speakeasy.net> hat am 1. Februar = 2013 > > > > um 08:37 geschrieben: > > > >=20 > > > > > > > > > You are describing film/video Productio= n in > > > > > > > > > general. And film/video production is now just > > > > > > > > > another literacy, like writing, that people grow= up > > > > > > > > > with. So, yes, there are a lot of folks who just > > > > > > > > > start doing it, and we are awash in competition. > > > > > > > > > There is a tremendous amount of incompetence. Bu= t at > > > > > > > > > the same time if you have the potential for tale= nt > > > > > > > > > you are not excluded by inaccessibility to tools= . > > > > > > > > > I'll take the trade off. I find today to be just= as > > > > > > > > > exciting a time as the 90's were. > > > > >=20 > > > > > James > > > > >=20 > > > > >=20 > > > > > On Jan 31, 2013, at 11:03 PM, mylenium@mylenium.de wrote= : > > > > >=20 > > > > >=20 > > > > > > > > > > > You're talking like people = at > > > > > > > > > > > the retirement home getting all > > > > > > > > > > > sentimental... ;-) Things will never be = the > > > > > > > > > > > same. AE has arrived at being "just anot= her > > > > > > > > > > > software" that is being used by more peo= ple > > > > > > > > > > > with no talent or skills than by ones wh= o > > > > > > > > > > > actually intimately know it. It's just t= he > > > > > > > > > > > way it is, sadly... > > > > > >=20 > > > > > > Mylenium > > > > > >=20 > > > > > > [Pour Myl=C3=A8ne, ange sur terre] > > > > > > ----------------------------------------- > > > > > > www.mylenium.de > > > > > >=20 > > > > > > Jim Lang < james.c.lang@gmail.com> hat am 1. Febru= ar > > > > > > 2013 um 06:29 geschrieben: > > > > > > > Darn- Totally missed it. > > > > > > > I've been thinking about the AE history lately. = I was > > > > > > > at a pottery > > > > > > > workshop, and > > > > > > > the teacher kept telling us that if anyone asked > > > > > > > "how'd you do that!" > > > > > >=20 > > > > > > > > > > >=20 > > > > > > > > >=20 > > > > > > >=20 > > > > > >=20 >=20 > -- > Animator & Editor > www.teddygage.com > Brooklyn >=20 >=20 ------=_Part_61495_2124214711.1359734804268 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =20 =20 =20 =20
Fair enough. Point taken. ;-)
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Mylenium
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[Pour Mylène, ange sur terre]
-----------------------------------------
www.mylenium.de
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Teddy Gage <teddygage@gmail.com> hat am 1. Februar 2013 um = 17:05 geschrieben:
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With all that "back in my day computers used punch cards and it too= k three hours to render a line" I thought for sure you were at least 70= .  Don't criticize people for reminiscing then go all gru= mpy old men yourself, is all I'm saying...=20
:D

On Friday, February 1, 2013,=20 mylenium@mylenium.de wrote= :
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Whoa... Retirement at 38... Now that would be something... (Not tha= t I would object with my health problems and all...)
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Mylenium
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[Pour Mylène, ange sur terre]=20
-----------------------------------------=20
www.mylenium.d= e
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Teddy Gage < teddygage@gmail.com> hat am 1. Februar= 2013 um 16:47 geschrieben:
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"When I started out as an 3d artist 19 years ago"...= 0;
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You wouldn't happen to be typing this from the retirem= ent home computer, would you? 
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You're certainly grumpy enough to be a grandfather...=20 =20
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Sent from my iPad
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On Feb 1, 2013, at 10:38 AM, "=20 mylenium@mylenium.de" <=20 mylenium@mylenium.de> wrote:=20
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I tend to see it from a different angle, coming from a 3D grap= hics background. I don't think anyone was actually excluded in the past= . People just take affordable equipment or things like discounted education= versions for granted these days, luxuries we never had. There wasn't e= ven something like Blender around when I started out as an 3D artist 19 yea= rs ago. And still, if you only wanted hard enough you could somehow manage = to buy your tools no matter how expensive they may have been (not talking a= bout a 50000 bucks SGI workstation and another 70000 bucks Power Animator l= icense, obviously; more like a 3000 bucks Lightwave license). And instead o= f the annual upgrade death spiral we have now, they got an update every 2 y= ears and you actually had time to learn them and hone your skills and save = the money. It works in many ways, if you get my meaning.... And seeing how = many people struggle with even the simplest tutorials, I'm not sure if = it's just a "literacy" people can pick up or it produces more t= alent in any way... To me, it still comes down to this: People, who can'= ;t draw a straight line with a pencil probably shouldn't call themselve= s "motiongraphics artist". Or in other words: I consider a classica= l training/ education just as important or even more important than just ha= cking around on the computer or doing odd things with your digital camera..= ..
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=20
Mylenium
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=20
[Pour Mylène, ange sur terre]=20
-----------------------------------------=20
=20 www.mylen= ium.de
=20

James Culbertson <=20 albion@speakeasy.net> hat am 1. Februar 2013 um 08:= 37 geschrieben:
=20
=20
=20
You are describing film/video Production in general. And fil= m/video production is now just another literacy, like writing, that people = grow up with. So, yes, there are a lot of folks who just start doing it, an= d we are awash in competition. There is a tremendous amount of incompe= tence. But at the same time if you have the potential for talent you a= re not excluded by inaccessibility to tools. I'll take the trade off. I= find today to be just as exciting a time as the 90's were.
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=20
James
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On Jan 31, 2013, at 11:03 PM,=20 mylenium@mylenium.de wrote:
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You're talking like people at the retirement home get= ting all sentimental... ;-) Things will never be the same. AE has arrived a= t being "just another software" that is being used by more people w= ith no talent or skills than by ones who actually intimately know it. It= 9;s just the way it is, sadly...
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=20
Mylenium
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=20
[Pour Mylène, ange sur terre]=20  =20
-----------------------------------------=20  =20
=20 www= .mylenium.de
=20

Jim Lang <=20 james.c.lang@gmail.com> hat am 1. Februar 2013= um 06:29 geschrieben:=20  =20
> Darn- Totally missed it.=20  =20
> I've been thinking about the AE history la= tely. I was at a pottery=20  =20
> workshop, and=20  =20
> the teacher kept telling us that if anyone ask= ed "how'd you do that!"
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--=20
Animator & Editor
=20 www.teddygage.com
Brooklyn

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