Mailing List AE-List@media-motion.tv ? Message #49325
From: Robert Kjettrup <robert@stvmayday.dk>
Subject: Re: [AE] AE to QT Color Problem
Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2013 13:30:50 +0200
To: After Effects Mail List <AE-List@media-motion.tv>
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Are you guys seriously using the h264 encoder in QT? it is really dated. 
i must admit i have not used it in years and don't know if it has been updated. But everytime a client asks for an QT h264 i just encode an MP4 and there is no problem for them to play it back. And telling them to use VLC to view it too if they are a bit computer savy, and there is no gamma issues.

QT is really a love/hate application, it is really useful in many cases, like adding audio to videos without reencoding, and we use QT wraps for all our masters in DNxHD or Prores and most applications read them correct, even if the QT player shows a small wrong display gamma. But it really is annoying that this h264 seriously wrong display gamma bug has been there for all these years, what 7+ years, more? and nothing have been done to fix it. All the workarounds are really just workarounds for something that just should work probably without any modification.
So much for Apple's mantra, "it just works!"... more like "we don't care!"

- Robert 



2013/6/4 Jayse Hansen <mographer@gmail.com>
I've found a way that works for me at least. It's the single most annoying thing about quicktime. I've spent years dealing with that crap LoL. I've done all of the above - many times in many different ways (even many variations of x264) and nothing works reliably. Problem is you don't know if your clients are using QT7, 10 - or whatever - and having them change their QT is also an unknown variable I'd rather not deal with. 

But with way too much trial and error I've discovered something that works, at last - at least for me in my current setup. And it's so simple:

In AE project settings, enable color management, set as sRGB, and check the checkbox for match legacy. 

Bam - now you can render your QT's h264's alongside jpg sequences or whatever and they will all match between qt7, qt10, sequences etc. to about 99% - which is sooooo much better than the nasty 60% gamma/sat shift you usually experience. 

I guess qt is expecting some srgb color management? I decided to try it after reading Ken Rockwell's article on photography color management (http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/color-management/is-for-wimps.htm) and how just making everything sRGB is a reliable way to work on stills because most everything assumes sRGB. I thought - well QT is pretty consumer-based, decided to try it for video and voila... who would have known. 

Hope it works for you. 

// jayse


--------------------------------
Jayse Hansen
Fake UI design for Cinema



On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 11:45 PM, David Torno <torno@sydefxink.com> wrote:
No pro uses Quicktime exporting for anything else but basic reviewing
I'd be careful saying that. Plenty of pros use QT for more than just previewing. ;)
Final delivery in some cases. The codec is what makes the difference.


David Torno
Visual Effects Artist & Supervisor
---------------------
http://aeioweyou.blogspot.com

"The most useless day is that in which we do not laugh"
-Charles Field

On Jun 3, 2013, at 11:29 PM, Olivier Burri <ogburri@gmail.com> wrote:

Use Image Sequence instead.
It's a known problem.
No pro uses Quicktime exporting for anything else but basic reviewing


On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 8:08 AM, David Torno <torno@sydefxink.com> wrote:
Ya, I use to use x264. It was amazing, but it always seemed to stop working after a few weeks or so. It would just cause a crash for any app using the codec. When it was working, it was great and did replicate color very accurately. Unfortunately it was too unstable for me, so I had to ditch it.


David Torno
Visual Effects Artist & Supervisor
---------------------
http://aeioweyou.blogspot.com

"The most useless day is that in which we do not laugh"
-Charles Field

On Jun 3, 2013, at 10:06 PM, Chris Meyer <chris@crishdesign.com> wrote:

That work around doesn't always work. I far prefer to use the x264 variant of the h.264 codec.

Background: http://provideocoalition.com/cmg_keyframes/story/brightness_issues_with_h264_quicktime_movies

I'll email you the codec separately. Install in Library > QuickTime.

 - Chris


________________________________________________
Chris Meyer | Crish Design
http://www.crishdesign.com

On Jun 3, 2013, at 7:14 PM, Lachlan Westfall <lachlan@quietearth.net> wrote:

Thanks.... Trying this now...

-L

On 6/3/13 5:53 PM, "David Torno" <torno@sydefxink.com> wrote:

H.264 rendered from AE or exported from QT Pro will always come out washed out and pale in the saturation. In QT Pro you need to open "Show Movie Properties" under window, select  "Video Track" > "Visual Settings" and click the "Transparency" dropdown and choose "Composition". This will bring the video gamma very closely back to the original source.

David Torno
Visual Effects Artist & Supervisor
http://www.ghosttownmedia.com
O: 213.739.2290
C: 818.391.6060
---------------------
http://www.sydefxink.com
http://aeioweyou.blogspot.com
http://mactex.blogspot.com

"The most useless day is that in which we do not laugh"
-Charles Field

On Jun 3, 2013, at 5:42 PM, Lachlan Westfall <lachlan@quietearth.net> wrote:

Re: [AE] AE to QT Color Problem I’m rendering out lossless, then converting to H.264 via QT. The problem can be seen even in the lossless version.

I also just found something in the AE preferences about matching legacy QT gamma adjustments. I wonder if this has something to do with it?

-L

On 6/3/13 5:37 PM, "scott.aelist" <scott.aelist@gmail.com> wrote:

What codec are you using?




 
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