Return-Path: Received: from mail-ie0-f179.google.com ([209.85.223.179] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.10) with ESMTP-TLS id 5141067 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Sat, 13 Jul 2013 16:32:32 +0200 Received: by mail-ie0-f179.google.com with SMTP id c10so22723340ieb.38 for ; Sat, 13 Jul 2013 07:43:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to:content-type; bh=m10y73AtLMqhHFLcQVA4t2mmMTI0FrW5HBqEmrOY6fI=; b=tydHoTBzo+rgxsirLQU53ejxk0QoF8f1Z+eNEexsqYsmLWTku6V3SK7Ygo9S6D081O gnjx96iHtw0LMZU3Qq7arRgnZeHyBIUt4zp5lwBvt5b75gQrUcWj9KfeVgMXFPnQhXfW 1x56SIpOFfvV70sf83xZ3z9Mk8vkFVsjDo2ieI2qI+Bhh5moTXJRGeA0iWbHPlPn678T QtttH3/Bj6lajK9xfMo7MzjEWUOc6wo2yZfIQ0L/iF2k4st+Jo66Zj5ch9PZIw06Ntz3 vonCHCzPNlXdUYuSbdutgNLtCrweuVc66KbD9Ou/lb790PyFn007WAsYERO+faNHufxG iG3w== X-Received: by 10.42.33.129 with SMTP id i1mr14329314icd.95.1373726606039; Sat, 13 Jul 2013 07:43:26 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.5.201 with HTTP; Sat, 13 Jul 2013 07:43:05 -0700 (PDT) From: "Mr. Eric D. Kirk" Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2013 10:43:05 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [AE] Best Render Settings for Color Match [for Jayse] To: After Effects Mail List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=bcaec51018f75f227004e165a68e --bcaec51018f75f227004e165a68e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Jayse or anyone that might know, I finally got around to trying this and set the AE project settings as you specified but when I try it in Adobe Bridge, it gives me an error of "Suite Color Management Not Enabled, Suite Color Management requires that a qualifying product has been launched at least once to enable this feature". Any idea how to fix that? I thought having just enabled the setting in AE, maybe relaunching AE might work and then launching bridge again but it did not. Appreciate it. Eric On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 3:27 PM, Mr. Eric D. Kirk wrote: > Got it. Thanks! > > Eric > > On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 3:24 PM, Jayse Hansen wrote: > >> ur welcome - >> >> >Where exactly do I go for these Bridge settings? >> >> you go to Adobe Bridge - the program - and look at the bottom of its Edit >> menu. >> >> It's a program I rarely use - but it does have a super awesome renaming >> function for renaming image sequences to the folder name. >> >> hope that helps! >> >> // jayse >> >> -------------------------------- >> Jayse Hansen >> Fancy Fake UI design for Film >> www.jayse.tv >> jayse@jayse.tv >> 702-321-3449 >> >> >> >> On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 11:44 AM, Mr. Eric D. Kirk < >> kirkproductions@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Jayse, >>> >>> Excellent information. Thanks! >>> >>> Where exactly do I go for these Bridge settings? >>> >>> Eric >>> >>> On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 2:35 PM, Jayse Hansen wrote: >>> >>>> 'Fool's errand' is kinda right - color is a mess still. >>>> >>>> But there's a few things you can do. >>>> >>>> Keep it as simple as possible - make sure your apps are set to be all >>>> the same via Bridge - choose edit/creative suite color settings. I use >>>> north american web/internet. This is sRGB - which if you keep everything in >>>> this mode - it's kinda no muss no fuss. >>>> >>>> In ae - if you're rendering out h264/ or Prores etc. (mp4/mov) I've >>>> found you'll experience awful gamma/saturation shifts unless you go to >>>> project settings - enable working space set to srgb and check 'Match Legacy >>>> AE Quicktime Gamma Adjustments". Then your renders should match your comp >>>> view pretty dang close. >>>> >>>> Pretty much everything you use will assume sRGB so I've found it's good >>>> to just keep everything in that mode. >>>> >>>> Hope that helps! >>>> >>>> // jayse >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -------------------------------- >>>> Jayse Hansen >>>> Fancy Fake UI design for Film >>>> www.jayse.tv >>>> jayse@jayse.tv >>>> 702-321-3449 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:08 PM, Mr. Eric D. Kirk < >>>> kirkproductions@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> The gamma differences, I'm sure can play a part but if I get a still >>>>> that suits him, then gamma is no longer a player. So, whatever it looks >>>>> like on his end should still look that way whether I render 1 frame or >>>>> 4000. I mean if I rendered a white frame and sent to him and he saw black >>>>> but was happy with black, then every white frame I send, should be black to >>>>> him. lol If that makes any sense. :) >>>>> >>>>> So, I'm just trying to ensure that the single frame example reflects >>>>> the rest. And just to further clarify, I am also seeing the difference >>>>> myself between a still and a video that I render. >>>>> >>>>> I rendered a still that had the perfect greenish hue that he wanted >>>>> then I rendered full video and the greens were several notches up. >>>>> >>>>> But I will fiddle with it more tonight and see if the DNX codec helps >>>>> or maybe I go to the extreme and try and press the greens to a lesser >>>>> degree so that it looks good on render. >>>>> >>>>> Eric >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:58 PM, rik bogusz wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> well, could it just be simply the mac-pc gamma differences? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Jul 9, 2013, at 10:56 AM, "Mr. Eric D. Kirk" < >>>>>> kirkproductions@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks James. I'm on a PC. >>>>>> >>>>>> I have the cinepac thing to convert to prores though. >>>>>> >>>>>> Eric >>>>>> >>>>>> On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:46 PM, James Culbertson < >>>>>> albion@speakeasy.net> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I've had good luck with ProRes to x264 through Episode Pro when >>>>>>> played back on my own system. But the minute you send it anywhere else >>>>>>> forget about it. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> James >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Jul 9, 2013, at 10:41 AM, Teddy Gage wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> try out the free avid dnx codec package, it includes a 4444 lossless >>>>>>> codec that has worked well for me in the past >>>>>>> >>>>>>> like Steve said though, unless you have a $5,000 monitor and a >>>>>>> $3,000 calibrator for every monitor good luck ever achieving this. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> at a minimum you'd need a quadro that supports 10bit color output >>>>>>> and a monitor that supports it >>>>>>> >>>>>>> and the codec is going to do all kinds of hell, not to mention codec >>>>>>> -> vimeo servers compression (they do their own compression server-side) it >>>>>>> will be nearly impossible to maintain that exact color. I do seem to think >>>>>>> mp4 has better color support than h264 but the temporal compression is >>>>>>> pretty bad, so it's a trade-off >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 9:03 PM, Mr. Eric D. Kirk < >>>>>>> kirkproductions@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello All, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'm working a project where the person has an eye for color like >>>>>>>> you wouldn't believe and any slight change in color after render is >>>>>>>> presenting a problem for me. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> What are the best AE render settings to maintain color from my AE >>>>>>>> CS6 project? I'm spending an enormous amount of time rendering so I need >>>>>>>> this to work right. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> In one shot, my greens seem to have jumped up a few notches in the >>>>>>>> rendered file. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> And just some additional info. The plan is to render out the files >>>>>>>> from AE, then take in to Adobe Premiere to render out an HD file suitable >>>>>>>> for Vimeo. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Appreciate it. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Eric >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> *Eric D. Kirk | **Kirk Productions* >>>>>>>> *The Night Visitor | VFX* >>>>>>>> *443.206.1347 >>>>>>>> www.kirkproductions.com >>>>>>>> kirkproductions@gmail.com* >>>>>>>> *IMDB: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3351363/* >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Animator & Editor >>>>>>> www.teddygage.com >>>>>>> Brooklyn >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> *Eric D. Kirk | **Kirk Productions* >>>>>> *The Night Visitor | VFX* >>>>>> *443.206.1347 >>>>>> www.kirkproductions.com >>>>>> kirkproductions@gmail.com* >>>>>> *IMDB: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3351363/* >>>>>> * * >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> *Eric D. Kirk | **Kirk Productions* >>>>> *The Night Visitor | VFX* >>>>> *443.206.1347 >>>>> www.kirkproductions.com >>>>> kirkproductions@gmail.com* >>>>> *IMDB: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3351363/* >>>>> * * >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> *Eric D. Kirk | **Kirk Productions* >>> *The Night Visitor | VFX* >>> *443.206.1347 >>> www.kirkproductions.com >>> kirkproductions@gmail.com* >>> *IMDB: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3351363/* >>> * * >>> >> >> > > > -- > *Eric D. Kirk | **Kirk Productions* > *The Night Visitor | VFX* > *443.206.1347 > www.kirkproductions.com > kirkproductions@gmail.com* > *IMDB: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3351363/* > * * > -- *Eric D. Kirk | **Kirk Productions* *The Night Visitor | VFX* *443.206.1347 www.kirkproductions.com kirkproductions@gmail.com* *IMDB: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3351363/* * * --bcaec51018f75f227004e165a68e Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jayse or anyone that might know,

I finally got around to= trying this and set the AE project settings as you specified but when I tr= y it in Adobe Bridge, it gives me an error of "Suite Color Management = Not Enabled, Suite Color Management requires that a qualifying product has = been launched at least once to enable this feature".

Any idea how to fix that? =A0I thought having just enab= led the setting in AE, maybe relaunching AE might work and then launching b= ridge again but it did not.

Appreciate it.

Eric

On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 3:2= 7 PM, Mr. Eric D. Kirk <kirkproductions@gmail.com> w= rote:
Got it.=A0 Thanks!

Eric
On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 3:24 PM, Jay= se Hansen <mographer@gmail.com> wrote:
ur welcome -=A0

>Where exactly do = I go for these Bridge settings?

you go to Adobe Bridge - the program - and look at the bottom of its Edi= t menu.=A0

It's a program I rarely use - but it does have a super awesome renam= ing function for renaming image sequences to the folder name.=A0

hop= e that helps!

// jayse

<= div dir=3D"ltr">
----------= ----------------------
Jayse Hansen
Fancy Fake UI design for Film
jayse@jayse.tv



On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 11:44 AM, Mr. Er= ic D. Kirk <kirkproductions@gmail.com> wrote:
Jayse,
=A0
Excellent information.=A0 Thanks!=A0
=A0
Where exactly do I go for these Bridge settings?
=A0
Eric

On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 2:35 PM, Jayse Hans= en <mographer@gmail.com> wrote:
'Fool's errand' is kinda righ= t - color is a mess still.=A0

But there's a few things you can do.

Keep it as simple as possible - make sure your apps are set to be all= the same via Bridge - choose edit/creative suite color settings. I use nor= th american web/internet. This is sRGB - which if you keep everything in th= is mode - it's kinda no muss no fuss.

In ae - if you're rendering out h264/ or Prores etc. (mp= 4/mov) I've found you'll experience awful gamma/saturation shifts u= nless you go to project settings - enable working space set to srgb and che= ck 'Match Legacy AE Quicktime Gamma Adjustments". Then your render= s should match your comp view pretty dang close.=A0

Pretty much everything you use will assume sRGB so I= 9;ve found it's good to just keep everything in that mode.=A0

Hope that helps!

// jayse

=A0




--------------------------------
Jayse Hansen
Fancy Fake UI design for Film
jayse@jayse.tv



On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:08 PM, Mr. Eric= D. Kirk <kirkproductions@gmail.com> wrote:
The gamma differences, I'm sure can=A0play a part but if I get a s= till that suits him, then gamma is no longer a player. So, whatever it look= s like on his end should still look that way whether I render 1 frame or 40= 00.=A0 I mean if I rendered a=A0white frame and sent to him and he saw blac= k but was happy with black, then every white frame I send, should be black = to him. lol=A0 If that makes any sense. :)
=A0
So, I'm just trying to ensure that the single frame = example reflects the rest.=A0 And just to further clarify, I am also seeing= the difference myself between a still and a video that I render.
=A0
I rendered a still that had the perfect greenish hue that he = wanted then I rendered full video and the greens were several notches up.
=A0
But I will fiddle with it more tonight and see if th= e DNX codec helps or maybe I go to the extreme and try and press the greens= to a lesser degree so that it looks good on render.
=A0
Eric
=A0


=A0
On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:58 PM, rik bog= usz <rik.gaijin@mac.com> wrote:
well, could= it just be simply the mac-pc gamma differences?


On Jul 9, 2013, at 10:56 AM, &= quot;Mr. Eric D. Kirk" <kirkproductions@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks James.=A0 I'm on a PC.
=A0
I have the c= inepac thing to convert to prores though.

Eric

<= div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:46 PM, James Culbertson = <albion@speakeasy.net> wrote:
I've had good= luck with ProRes to x264 through Episode Pro when played back on my own sy= stem. But the minute you send it anywhere else forget about it.

James


On Jul 9, 2013,= at 10:41 AM, Teddy Gage wrote:

try out the free avid dnx codec package, it include= s a 4444 lossless codec that has worked well for me in the past

like Steve said though, unless you have a $5,000 monitor and a $3= ,000 calibrator for every monitor good luck ever achieving this.

at a minimum you'd need a quadro that supports 10bit color ou= tput and a monitor that supports it

and the codec is going to = do all kinds of hell, not to mention codec -> vimeo servers compression = (they do their own compression server-side) it will be nearly impossible to= maintain that exact color. I do seem to think mp4 has better color support= than h264 but the temporal compression is pretty bad, so it's a trade-= off


On Mon,= Jul 8, 2013 at 9:03 PM, Mr. Eric D. Kirk <kirkproductions@gmail.c= om> wrote:
Hello All,

I'm working a project where the person has an eye f= or color like you wouldn't believe and any slight change in color after= render is presenting a problem for me.

What are t= he best AE render settings to maintain color from my AE CS6 project? =A0I&#= 39;m spending an enormous amount of time rendering so I need this to work r= ight.

In one shot, my greens seem to have jumped up a few not= ches in the rendered file. =A0

And just some addit= ional info. =A0The plan is to render out the files from AE, then take in to= Adobe Premiere to render out an HD file suitable for Vimeo.

Appreciate it.

Eric

Eric D. Kirk |=A0Kirk Productions
The Night Vi= sitor | VFX



--
Animator & Editor
= www.teddygage= .com
Brooklyn

<= /span>



--
Eric D. Kirk |=A0= Kirk Productions
The Night Visitor | VFX
=A0




--
Eric D. Kirk |=A0Kirk Productions
<= b>The Night Visitor | VFX
=A0




--
Eric D. Kirk |=A0Kirk Productions
The Night Visito= r | VFX
=A0


--
Eric D. Kirk |=A0Kirk = Productions
The Night Visitor | VFX
=A0



--
Eric D. Kirk |=A0Kirk Productions
The Nig= ht Visitor | VFX
=A0
--bcaec51018f75f227004e165a68e--