Return-Path: Received: from nk11p00mm-asmtp003.mac.com ([17.158.161.2] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.10) with ESMTP id 5319229 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Mon, 16 Dec 2013 20:28:47 +0100 Received: from [192.168.1.68] (99-152-153-100.lightspeed.dllstx.sbcglobal.net [99.152.153.100]) by nk11p00mm-asmtp003.mac.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 7u4-27.08(7.0.4.27.7) 64bit (built Aug 22 2013)) with ESMTPSA id <0MXW002TQZKKVQ70@nk11p00mm-asmtp003.mac.com> for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Mon, 16 Dec 2013 19:31:40 +0000 (GMT) X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10432:5.11.87,1.0.14,0.0.0000 definitions=2013-12-16_01:2013-12-16,2013-12-16,1970-01-01 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 spamscore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 adultscore=0 bulkscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=7.0.1-1308280000 definitions=main-1312160131 From: Jim Curtis Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_80135AD8-7282-4229-A45A-491058E935DA" Message-id: <838215E8-09BF-4776-82C9-458FD845733A@me.com> MIME-version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.6 \(1510\)) Subject: Re: [AE] [AE] When time for 4K TV/video Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2013 13:31:32 -0600 References: To: After Effects Mail List , brian@totaltraining.com In-reply-to: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1510) --Apple-Mail=_80135AD8-7282-4229-A45A-491058E935DA Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Interesting. I have 3x DSL (24 Mb down; 3 up), and I view Netflix = through my BR player and ethernet. I get a few buffering pauses on most = programs, generally right at the beginning; some times later on into the = show. Looks pretty good generally, except in dissolves and fades, which = are blocky. Amazon Prime HD slightly worse. I also see many last frames repeated = prior to cuts. Strange, annoying, and probably not even noticed by most = people. Both services seem to analyze my connection speed, and adjust quality to = suit. That might account for the difference in our viewing experiences. On Dec 16, 2013, at 1:23 PM, brian@totaltraining.com wrote: > That first statement is not true here; Netflix HD looks much better = than any broadcast station on our system... I use a PS3 or Apple TV as a = Netflix host, and am comparing it with Verizon HD... the Netflix stream = has better detail (especially in the shadows) and less noise in general = than broadcast. It's still not Blu-Ray, but it ain't bad. > =20 > I do have a very fat internet pipe into the house so I'm sure that has = something to do with the quality. >=20 > Brian > =20 > ------ Original Message ------ > From: "Jim Curtis" > To: "After Effects Mail List" > Sent: 12/16/2013 2:12:44 PM > Subject: Re: [AE] When time for 4K TV/video >> What they now call HD over Netflix (for example) is a joke as it is = now. Fiber or satellite will be mandatory for real-time broadcast (and = not slow download to a local server as with the current Sony 4K), and it = could be decades before everybody has either. Hopefully not satellite, = because those antennae are visual blights on our landscape. >>=20 >> Significant available content would be important to me, too. >>=20 >> To me, HD isn't just about pixels=85 it's also about not seeing = compression artifacts. I don't consider it HD if it's upscaled or = blocky or time-smeared. But,what do I know? >>=20 >> But, to the OP, the time to upgrade your gear IMO is when your = clients are demanding it, and not a second sooner (unless you just like = being the first kid on your block to have it, for which you pay a = premium).=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> On Dec 16, 2013, at 11:08 AM, adam mercado wrote: >>=20 >>> =46rom what I understand, even basic HD uptake amongst general = consumers has been pitifully slow, so I don't expect 4k to become a = player anytime soon. I also heard 3D TVs are already on their way out, = as they flopped in the marketplace. Joe Consumer is neither interested = nor educated enough to appreciate the difference. Big screen =3D better = picture and that is all. If it takes off it will be with niche, experts = and hobbyists. Just my speculation. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Adam Mercado >>> Influxx Media Production >>> Fullerton, CA >>>=20 >>> Moving Images. For Business >>> 714=B0928=B09896 >>> http://www.influxx.com/ >>> http://www.twitter.com/influxx >>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/influxx >>> http://influxx.tumblr.com/archive >>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/influxx >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On Dec 16, 2013, at 4:51 AM, Greg Balint wrote: >>>=20 >>>> As an owner of a 1080p home theater projector as my main TV, with a = 135" screen and 1gb fiber optic ISP. I cannot welcome a new 4k overlord = soon enough. >>>>=20 >>>> I'd expect places like mine and also wherever Google fiber is = installed will first start toying with 4k on demand videos to see the = usage patterns, etc. But I'd expect it'd be at least another 2-3 years = before it is more common place or at least more of a household word. >>>>=20 >>>> ///Greg Balint >>>> //Art Director / Motion Graphics Designer >>>> /321.514.4839 >>>> delRAZOR.com/ >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> On Dec 16, 2013 7:44 AM, "Anders Sundstedt" = wrote: >>>> Thanks Mylenium, >>>> =20 >>>> I will read Stu=92s article. >>>> =20 >>>> They recently started advertising a 4K TV for sale on UK = television, so I was thinking, what would they be able to use it for at = the moment. >>>> =20 >>>> Thanks, >>>> =20 >>>> Anders >>>> =20 >>>> From: mylenium@mylenium.de >>>> Sent: Monday, December 16, 2013 12:38 PM >>>> To: After Effects Mail List >>>> Subject: Re: [AE] When time for 4K TV/video >>>> =20 >>>> You might want to read Stu Maschwitz' "4k in the home" article or = so.... It won't necessarily be better in terms what you actually will = see and so far no major broadcaster has announced any firm plans. I = believe they will use it to some effect during the soccer world = championships for crop & pan to HD, but beyond that I would think 4k = will be mostly a production format for some time. It's kind this weird = situation where on a reasonably sized home screen you won't be able to = see much of a difference because your eye can't keep up and compression = will eradicate some of the sharpness while at the same time only so many = people will even have a flat/ condo/ room in their house where they = could sit far enough from the screen to actually draw benefits from 4k. = Stu nails those points perfectly... >>>> Mylenium >>>> [Pour Myl=E8ne, ange sur terre]=20 >>>> -----------------------------------------=20 >>>> http://www.mylenium.de/ >>>>> Anders Sundstedt hat am 16. Dezember 2013 = um 13:28 geschrieben:=20 >>>>>=20 >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I am curious to know when you think 4K TV will become popular and = when/what channels and what TV boxes will actually start broadcasting = 4K. >>>>> I am also curious on how you would buy a 4K film, what home use = formats and players would support this at the moment if any? >>>>> Same with internet/YouTube, when do you think something better = than 1080p will be an option? >>>>> I have two reasons for asking this: 1) When is it time to consider = making my animations in 4K, 2) when would it be any idea to upgrade my = TV from a 1080p to a 4K tv. >>>>> Thanks >>>>> Anders Sundstedt >>>>> http://sundstedt.co.uk/ >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>=20 >>=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail=_80135AD8-7282-4229-A45A-491058E935DA Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Interesting.  I have 3x = DSL (24 Mb down; 3 up), and I view Netflix through my BR player and = ethernet.  I get a few buffering pauses on most programs, generally = right at the beginning; some times later on into the show.  Looks = pretty good generally, except in dissolves and fades, which are = blocky.

Amazon Prime HD slightly worse.  I = also see many last frames repeated prior to cuts.  Strange, = annoying, and probably not even noticed by most = people.

Both services seem to analyze my = connection speed, and adjust quality to suit.  That might account = for the difference in our viewing = experiences.




On Dec 16, 2013, at 1:23 PM, brian@totaltraining.com = wrote:

jpcurtis@me.com>
To: = "After Effects Mail List" <AE-List@media-motion.tv>
Sent: 12/16/2013 2:12:44 PM
Subject: Re: [AE] When = time for 4K TV/video
What they now call HD over = Netflix (for example) is a joke as it is now.  Fiber or satellite = will be mandatory for real-time broadcast (and not slow download to a = local server as with the current Sony 4K), and it could be decades = before everybody has either.  Hopefully not satellite, because = those antennae are visual blights on our = landscape.

Significant available content would be = important to me, too.

To me, HD isn't just about = pixels=85 it's also about not seeing compression artifacts.  I = don't consider it HD if it's upscaled or blocky or time-smeared. =  But,what do I know?

But, to the OP, the = time to upgrade your gear IMO is when your clients are demanding it, and = not a second sooner (unless you just like being the first kid on your = block to have it, for which you pay a = premium). 


On Dec 16, 2013, = at 11:08 AM, adam mercado <adam@influxx.com> = wrote:

=46rom what I understand, even = basic HD uptake amongst general consumers has been pitifully slow, so I = don't expect 4k to become a player anytime soon. I also heard 3D TVs are = already on their way out, as they flopped in the marketplace. Joe = Consumer is neither interested nor educated enough to appreciate the = difference. Big screen =3D better picture and that is all. If it takes = off it will be with niche, experts and hobbyists. Just my = speculation.



On Dec = 16, 2013, at 4:51 AM, Greg Balint wrote:

As an owner of a 1080p home theater projector as my main TV, = with a 135" screen and 1gb fiber optic ISP. I cannot welcome a new 4k = overlord soon enough.

I'd expect places like mine and = also wherever Google fiber is installed will first start toying with 4k = on demand videos to see the usage patterns, etc. But I'd expect it'd be = at least another 2-3 years before it is more common place or at least = more of a household word.

///Greg Balint
//Art = Director / Motion Graphics Designer
/321.514.4839
delRAZOR.com/
   

<= div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Dec 16, 2013 7:44 AM, "Anders Sundstedt" = <sundstedt@hotmail.com>= wrote:
Thanks = Mylenium,
 
I will read Stu=92s = article.
 
They recently started advertising a = 4K TV for sale on UK television, so I was thinking, what would they be = able to use it for at the = moment.
 
Thanks,
 
Ande= rs
 
Sent: Monday, = December 16, 2013 12:38 PM
Subject: Re: [AE] When time for 4K = TV/video
 
You might want to read Stu = Maschwitz' "4k in the home" article or so.... It won't necessarily be = better in terms what you actually will see and so far no major = broadcaster has announced any firm plans. I believe they will use it to = some effect during the soccer world championships for crop & pan to = HD, but beyond that I would think 4k will be mostly a production format = for some time. It's kind this weird situation where on a reasonably = sized home screen you won't be able to see much of a difference because = your eye can't keep up and compression will eradicate some of the = sharpness while at the same time only so many people will even have a = flat/ condo/ room in their house where they could sit far enough from = the screen to actually draw benefits from 4k. Stu nails those points = perfectly...
Mylenium
[Pour = Myl=E8ne, ange sur terre] 
-------------------------= ---------------- 
http://www.mylenium.de/
Anders Sundstedt <sundstedt@hotmail.com> hat = am 16. Dezember 2013 um 13:28 geschrieben: 

http://sundstedt.co.uk/

 




= --Apple-Mail=_80135AD8-7282-4229-A45A-491058E935DA--