Return-Path: Received: from mail-qa0-f48.google.com ([209.85.216.48] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.10) with ESMTP-TLS id 5347055 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 15:01:28 +0100 Received: by mail-qa0-f48.google.com with SMTP id f11so912160qae.35 for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 06:05:18 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=rNm7PxJB63LEctdfgwMGQQdNU0VeEVw/3jQfHpheySA=; b=I6+ehaoTp1oPdxLjfWpK5DunC/rmdjaS+eKJVuZZmUBXcIYUCpvYKK6Kj0FKkBdJPz Q3N18+B74gI6zfjWLvgtorx8ltpLdRxcNsXK1+sd+zs/TckqeJpi/btCffn7qfxAVsIH yi7wTj8sqSDtmdA/u7Vws6vrH6Jo2RWz9wUtB/6R4lju7HtzE34qFwJaqY+qTVQS0tO7 wT4hcpUJNdbXZkvzb35UlsKcG/i3cKUsZMDwzzXSnWQFnGMF4jRGjTdiej9r6ho95TJq tKSILYv/CTAGLDU/yMAd5bCm9Qi92vRKm/fF/wJwlRnb3mEaOSc4QSs5hUx3B9MgJz16 MM9w== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.224.51.196 with SMTP id e4mr4912323qag.16.1389794717920; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 06:05:17 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.229.147.139 with HTTP; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 06:05:17 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.229.147.139 with HTTP; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 06:05:17 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2014 09:05:17 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [AE] Thoughts on ultra-high resolution From: Greg Balint To: After Effects Mail List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c29e5078f1ba04f002ccd2 --001a11c29e5078f1ba04f002ccd2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I mean, I can see this being like an airport installation or digital menu boards where clarity is actually important to read smaller text, which is why I asked. Could a possibility be that you work in half or 3/4 resolution and then do an upres for final delivery? Quite possibly the other solution would be to just tell them point blank the issues that would arise from the size they are asking for. Ask them what sort of machine they will be outputting this content with... Get in touch with the right people and they may provide the proper answer. (I.e. "we're going to run multiple monitors with spliced up videos so no video is larger than standard 4k, and the environment is such that the audience is always 20 feet away from the screens.") In my experience ( just finished a project at 9660x4500 for a launch event stage with multiple screens around the stage) even the simplest of renders will take forever st those resolutions. A black solid rendered out took about 3 hours. Maybe work at half res, then use the script that will scale up your comp in the final stages? ///Greg Balint //Art Director / Motion Graphics Designer /321.514.4839 delRAZOR.com/ On Jan 15, 2014 8:28 AM, "Dann Stubbs" wrote: > > On Jan 15, 2014, at 8:03 AM, Greg Balint wrote: > > Just a quick question. Sorry it's not on the path to an exact solution, > but... > > If it's a "wall" type setup, that means the intended audience is going to > be somewhat farther back from the displays, right? > > What size displays are we talking? Inches wise? > > Wouldn't it be worthless to work in 4k if the user will be so far away as > to not even notice the clarity of that resolution? > > ///Greg Balint > //Art Director / Motion Graphics Designer > /321.514.4839 > delRAZOR.com/ > > > > i see that stuff all the time - "clients" that want 600DPI for a bill > board at actual size etc yes like 60 feet x 40 feet at 600 DPI because > "that's the best quality" > > (typically billboards can easily be 72dpi or even half that for a > traditional billboard) it is a constant challenge to educate these people > over and over, and many artists won't do it - they are afraid of > confrontation, just do what they are asked no matter what. pass the buck, > pass the blame... > basically it is the end users/clients who just go by the hype and don't > understand anything at all about the underlying technology of it. > > in my last job - the "product developers" who in this case were just > technically office assistants that blew a lot of smoke about how "skilled" > they were to even less knowledgeable management and got these totally > undeserved titles and responsibilities - their job was to pick art for use > on products - one used to always to choose final art size at 8 x 10 > > when i stumbled across this unusual consistency, as the art was for > multiple various products - from small pin size, to things as large as a 4 > x 6 poster as example - i asked why this person kept asking for artwork to > be developed at 8 x 10 @ 300dpi for such a wide variety of sizes when the > art would be far to large for their small products and far too small for > the large poster size products (and would always need to be reworked again > once the too low for it's use crappy resolution showed itself - much of > this art was hand drawn and to start over for a different size was a big > expense) > > so, this multi-billion dollar company... this "product developer" in > charge of tens to hundreds of millions of dollars of items (who > most typically are of course snotty and "know better then everyone else" > attitude) > > when asked directly about WHY all their artwork is always developed at 8 x > 10 regardless of the product it is for > > their answer was "8 x 10 is the size of the color printout i want to look > at the artwork" (basically they wanted a color printout in letter size > paper to look at and organize their art products) > > zero comprehension > ___________________________________________________________________ > > Dann Stubbs - dann@darkskydigital.com > Dark Sky Digital - http://www.darkskydigital.com > > http://www.RenderKing.com Value Priced C4D, VRAY Render Farm > ___________________________________________________________________ > > > --001a11c29e5078f1ba04f002ccd2 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I mean, I can see this being like an airport installation or= digital menu boards where clarity is actually important to read smaller te= xt, which is why I asked.

Could a possibility be that you work in half or 3/4 resoluti= on and then do an upres for final delivery?

Quite possibly the other solution would be to just tell them= point blank the issues that would arise from the size they are asking for.= Ask them what sort of machine they will be outputting this content with...= Get in touch with the right people and they may provide the proper answer.= (I.e. "we're going to run multiple monitors with spliced up video= s so no video is larger than standard 4k, and the environment is such that = the audience is always 20 feet away from the screens.")

In my experience ( just finished a project at 9660x4500 for = a launch event stage with multiple screens around the stage) even the simpl= est of renders will take forever st those resolutions.=A0 A black solid ren= dered out took about 3 hours.

Maybe work at half res, then use the script that will scale = up your comp in the final stages?

///Greg Balint
//Art Director / Motion Graphics Designer
/321.514.4839
delRAZOR.com/
=A0=A0=A0

On Jan 15, 2014 8:28 AM, "Dann Stubbs"= <dann@darkskydigital.com= > wrote:


On Jan 15, 2014, at 8:03 AM, Greg Balint wrote:

Just a quick question. Sorry it's not o= n the path to an exact solution, but...

If it's a "wall" type setup, that means the in= tended audience is going to be somewhat farther back from the displays, rig= ht?

What size displays are we talking? Inches wise?

Wouldn't it be worthless to work in 4k if the user will be so far away = as to not even notice the clarity of that resolution?

///= Greg Balint
//Art Director / Motion Graphics Designer
/321.514.4839 delRAZOR.com/
=A0= =A0=A0


i see tha= t stuff all the time - "clients" that want 600DPI for a bill boar= d at actual size etc yes like 60 feet x 40 feet at 600 DPI because "th= at's the best quality"

=A0(typically billboards can easily be 72dpi or even half th= at for a traditional billboard) it is a constant challenge to educate these= people over and over, and many artists won't do it - they are afraid o= f confrontation, just do what they are asked no matter what. pass the buck,= pass the blame...

basically it is the end users/clients who just go by the hype an= d don't understand anything at all about the underlying technology of i= t.


in my last job - the "product de= velopers" who in this case were just technically office assistants tha= t blew a lot of smoke about how "skilled" they were to even less = knowledgeable management and got these totally undeserved titles and respon= sibilities - their job was to pick art for use on products - one used to al= ways to choose final art size at 8 x 10

when i stumbled across this unusual consistency, as the= art was for multiple various products - from small pin size, to things as = large as a 4 x 6 poster as example - i asked why this person kept asking fo= r artwork to be developed at 8 x 10 @ 300dpi for such a wide variety of siz= es when the art would be far to large for their small products and far too = small for the large poster size products (and would always need to be rewor= ked again once the too low for it's use crappy resolution showed itself= -=A0much of this art was hand drawn and to start over for a different size= was a big expense)

so, this multi-billion dollar company... this "pro= duct developer" in charge of tens to hundreds of millions of dollars o= f items (who most=A0typically=A0are of course snotty and "know better = then everyone else" attitude)

when asked directly about WHY all their artwork is alwa= ys developed at 8 x 10 regardless of the product it is for

their answer was "8 x 10 is the size of the color printout i = want to look at the artwork" =A0(basically they wanted a color printou= t in letter size paper to look at and organize their art products)

zero comprehension
___________________________________________________________________

Dann Stubbs=A0=A0-=A0=A0dann@darkskydigital.com
Dark Sky Digital -=A0=A0= http://www.dark= skydigital.com

http://www.RenderKing.com=A0=A0Value Priced C4D, VRA= Y Render Farm
___________________________________________________________________

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