Return-Path: Received: from mail-ee0-f52.google.com ([74.125.83.52] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.10) with ESMTP-TLS id 5347082 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 15:25:45 +0100 Received: by mail-ee0-f52.google.com with SMTP id e53so896541eek.39 for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 06:29:36 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:disposition-notification-to:date:from:user-agent :mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type; bh=qyj1Q8yJBF7WS3EE3tbNTfbuEAuq6L2JhqmGmGuMRl8=; b=WPS3Hwm5k1jFjKlHEodyBgYpGnkRELBZdj54fUhA2VHrZRF4i30eRKUiRdHveUhmar s9ayW/NBaF1G5idNGL3BHvaLJFEh6cj4ZLPCBtgWoEvtjU7jVRWSbBSfA48JuqePr7DU NAUahpkfCnW6M2F8Z3HG2k4i2gwkuaftKhDK/UUVzB19KHMHmVrJgyAsWACt1SOTxO8q ZuQErJ1ditvDFu3zfKyOb524LOPpGEvUpit/Soviv04A27ID4gVRTHZIATvc1B0dNP5l F7bNgM3Pid3OYnwLuE2XwAxRMuZvzRgfVI5Isv8L5q79lOD3lfqoPrVs+depVcYIOl92 goew== X-Received: by 10.14.209.129 with SMTP id s1mr4102779eeo.21.1389796176333; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 06:29:36 -0800 (PST) Return-Path: Received: from [192.168.1.5] ([92.118.233.240]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id n7sm10692952eef.5.2014.01.15.06.29.34 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 15 Jan 2014 06:29:35 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <52D69B5C.9040405@gmail.com> Disposition-Notification-To: Evan Fotis Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2014 16:29:48 +0200 From: Evan Fotis User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.1.17) Gecko/20080914 Lightning/0.9 Thunderbird/2.0.0.17 Mnenhy/0.7.5.666 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: After Effects Mail List Subject: Re: [AE] Thoughts on ultra-high resolution References: In-Reply-To: X-TagToolbar-Keys: D20140115162948423 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------050904080003070305050700" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------050904080003070305050700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I suppose pure vector graphics could be done fairly easy at these resolutions, since scaling is not an issue. Back to Flash animation or other. Reminds me of the early web years when bitmap videos where not an option. On 15-Jan-14 16:05, Greg Balint wrote: > > I mean, I can see this being like an airport installation or digital > menu boards where clarity is actually important to read smaller text, > which is why I asked. > > Could a possibility be that you work in half or 3/4 resolution and > then do an upres for final delivery? > > Quite possibly the other solution would be to just tell them point > blank the issues that would arise from the size they are asking for. > Ask them what sort of machine they will be outputting this content > with... Get in touch with the right people and they may provide the > proper answer. (I.e. "we're going to run multiple monitors with > spliced up videos so no video is larger than standard 4k, and the > environment is such that the audience is always 20 feet away from the > screens.") > > In my experience ( just finished a project at 9660x4500 for a launch > event stage with multiple screens around the stage) even the simplest > of renders will take forever st those resolutions.� A black solid > rendered out took about 3 hours. > > Maybe work at half res, then use the script that will scale up your > comp in the final stages? > > ///Greg Balint > //Art Director / Motion Graphics Designer > /321.514.4839 > delRAZOR.com/ > ��� > > On Jan 15, 2014 8:28 AM, "Dann Stubbs" > wrote: > > > On Jan 15, 2014, at 8:03 AM, Greg Balint wrote: > >> Just a quick question. Sorry it's not on the path to an exact >> solution, but... >> >> If it's a "wall" type setup, that means the intended audience is >> going to be somewhat farther back from the displays, right? >> >> What size displays are we talking? Inches wise? >> >> Wouldn't it be worthless to work in 4k if the user will be so far >> away as to not even notice the clarity of that resolution? >> >> ///Greg Balint >> //Art Director / Motion Graphics Designer >> /321.514.4839 >> delRAZOR.com/ >> ��� >> > > i see that stuff all the time - "clients" that want 600DPI for a > bill board at actual size etc yes like 60 feet x 40 feet at 600 > DPI because "that's the best quality" > > �(typically billboards can easily be 72dpi or even half that for a > traditional billboard) it is a constant challenge to educate these > people over and over, and many artists won't do it - they are > afraid of confrontation, just do what they are asked no matter > what. pass the buck, pass the blame... > > basically it is the end users/clients who just go by the hype and > don't understand anything at all about the underlying technology > of it. > > in my last job - the "product developers" who in this case were > just technically office assistants that blew a lot of smoke about > how "skilled" they were to even less knowledgeable management and > got these totally undeserved titles and responsibilities - their > job was to pick art for use on products - one used to always to > choose final art size at 8 x 10 > > when i stumbled across this unusual consistency, as the art was > for multiple various products - from small pin size, to things as > large as a 4 x 6 poster as example - i asked why this person kept > asking for artwork to be developed at 8 x 10 @ 300dpi for such a > wide variety of sizes when the art would be far to large for their > small products and far too small for the large poster size > products (and would always need to be reworked again once the too > low for it's use crappy resolution showed itself -�much of this > art was hand drawn and to start over for a different size was a > big expense) > > so, this multi-billion dollar company... this "product developer" > in charge of tens to hundreds of millions of dollars of items (who > most�typically�are of course snotty and "know better then everyone > else" attitude) > > when asked directly about WHY all their artwork is always > developed at 8 x 10 regardless of the product it is for > > their answer was "8 x 10 is the size of the color printout i want > to look at the artwork" �(basically they wanted a color printout > in letter size paper to look at and organize their art products) > > zero comprehension > ___________________________________________________________________ > > Dann Stubbs��-��dann@darkskydigital.com > > Dark Sky Digital -��http://www.darkskydigital.com > > http://www.RenderKing.com��Value Priced C4D, VRAY Render Farm > ___________________________________________________________________ > > --------------050904080003070305050700 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I suppose pure vector graphics could be done fairly easy at these resolutions, since scaling is not an issue.
Back to Flash animation or other.
Reminds me of the early web years when bitmap videos where not an option.
On 15-Jan-14 16:05, Greg Balint wrote:

I mean, I can see this being like an airport installation or digital menu boards where clarity is actually important to read smaller text, which is why I asked.

Could a possibility be that you work in half or 3/4 resolution and then do an upres for final delivery?

Quite possibly the other solution would be to just tell them point blank the issues that would arise from the size they are asking for. Ask them what sort of machine they will be outputting this content with... Get in touch with the right people and they may provide the proper answer. (I.e. "we're going to run multiple monitors with spliced up videos so no video is larger than standard 4k, and the environment is such that the audience is always 20 feet away from the screens.")

In my experience ( just finished a project at 9660x4500 for a launch event stage with multiple screens around the stage) even the simplest of renders will take forever st those resolutions.� A black solid rendered out took about 3 hours.

Maybe work at half res, then use the script that will scale up your comp in the final stages?

///Greg Balint
//Art Director / Motion Graphics Designer
/321.514.4839
delRAZOR.com/
���

On Jan 15, 2014 8:28 AM, "Dann Stubbs" <dann@darkskydigital.com> wrote:


On Jan 15, 2014, at 8:03 AM, Greg Balint wrote:

Just a quick question. Sorry it's not on the path to an exact solution, but...

If it's a "wall" type setup, that means the intended audience is going to be somewhat farther back from the displays, right?

What size displays are we talking? Inches wise?

Wouldn't it be worthless to work in 4k if the user will be so far away as to not even notice the clarity of that resolution?

///Greg Balint
//Art Director / Motion Graphics Designer
/321.514.4839
delRAZOR.com/
���


i see that stuff all the time - "clients" that want 600DPI for a bill board at actual size etc yes like 60 feet x 40 feet at 600 DPI because "that's the best quality"

�(typically billboards can easily be 72dpi or even half that for a traditional billboard) it is a constant challenge to educate these people over and over, and many artists won't do it - they are afraid of confrontation, just do what they are asked no matter what. pass the buck, pass the blame...

basically it is the end users/clients who just go by the hype and don't understand anything at all about the underlying technology of it.

in my last job - the "product developers" who in this case were just technically office assistants that blew a lot of smoke about how "skilled" they were to even less knowledgeable management and got these totally undeserved titles and responsibilities - their job was to pick art for use on products - one used to always to choose final art size at 8 x 10

when i stumbled across this unusual consistency, as the art was for multiple various products - from small pin size, to things as large as a 4 x 6 poster as example - i asked why this person kept asking for artwork to be developed at 8 x 10 @ 300dpi for such a wide variety of sizes when the art would be far to large for their small products and far too small for the large poster size products (and would always need to be reworked again once the too low for it's use crappy resolution showed itself -�much of this art was hand drawn and to start over for a different size was a big expense)

so, this multi-billion dollar company... this "product developer" in charge of tens to hundreds of millions of dollars of items (who most�typically�are of course snotty and "know better then everyone else" attitude)

when asked directly about WHY all their artwork is always developed at 8 x 10 regardless of the product it is for

their answer was "8 x 10 is the size of the color printout i want to look at the artwork" �(basically they wanted a color printout in letter size paper to look at and organize their art products)

zero comprehension
___________________________________________________________________

Dann Stubbs��-��dann@darkskydigital.com
Dark Sky Digital -��http://www.darkskydigital.com

http://www.RenderKing.com��Value Priced C4D, VRAY Render Farm
___________________________________________________________________



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