Mailing List AE-List@media-motion.tv ? Message #54452
From: Carey Dissmore <AE-List@media-motion.tv>
Subject: Re: [AE] Depreciated output formats gone completely in AE 2014
Date: Sat, 28 Jun 2014 08:12:18 -0500
To: After Effects Mail List <AE-List@media-motion.tv>
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Hi Gang,

Just chiming in with another perspective here.
I’ve seen a same/similar slide at numerous Adobe presentations in many cities, at many conferences, etc. over the past 3 years or so. That has shown that Adobe’s team are viewing their production-related apps as a modified hub-and-spoke model, or ecosystem, with PPro and Media Encoder at the center of that workflow. AE, Audition, Speedgrade and other apps are on the spokes feeding that hub. Since the move to CC, where everyone gets everything, this only makes more sense to take a suite-integrated approach. 

This model serves someone like myself very well (I typically integrate editorial and mograph all day), as it’s been my model to always work at the highest production codecs and resolutions in AE, then finish from the NLE (all audio in AE treated as “scratch”) for something like 17 or 18 years now (OMG!).  The move to push more things to AME is understandable, and now that CUDA effects are supported in it, some of the penalties are removed. (Dynamic link factors in there as appropriate.)

But having said all of that, I do understand that there are some artists, many of whom are right here in this community, who just live in AE all day every day and want it to be their finishing platform, but also the place where they dump out client approvals right from the render queue. This architectural move creates an extra step for someone like that...but overall I think we will all be better served by there being essentially one robust codebase for Adobe to maintain for these functions. What happens from a software development side (like with Mediacore) is that that codebase ends up getting transplanted into each individual application, where it then has to be modified to hook in. At that point it is another instance of that same/similar codebase and will inevitably “fork” in it’s development from the main. Then begins the work of reconciling feature changes, updates and fixes across numerous instances of the codebase that essentially duplicate functionality. It can really rack up the coding/development/QA hours with diminishing returns on user benefit. 

But…one thing I really want to speak up for is the tremendous value of having a render history stored within the AEP. I would like to see a solution that funnels this data back into the AEP and auto-saves it post-render. Back in the Gridiron X-Factor/Nucleo days they had this functionality happening (although it was a little clunky—it worked). 

All the best,
Carey

On Jun 28, 2014, at 12:20 AM, Stephen van Vuuren <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:

> to be a broken record, h.264 is NOT just web video. its capable of iFrame, deep color and high bit rates. please see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H.264 for a starter.
 
Not arguing there – but not aware of any Adobe or common NLE etc. encoders that support 10-bit iframe 444 H.264 and certainly not the deprecated AE format unless I was totally missing something.
 
But the larger issue here is that h.264 vs say ProRes 4444 is analogous to a DCDM vs a DCP in digital cinema. DCP is not your master, it’s your distribution master. It’s like keeping your audio masters at 320KB CBR MP3. Just not smart workflow/archiving in my view.
 
stephen van vuuren
336.202.4777
 
 
A film is – or should be – more like music than like fiction. It should be a progression of moods and feelings. The theme, what’s behind the emotion, the meaning, all that comes later.
–Stanley Kubrick
 
From: After Effects Mail List [mailto:AE-List@media-motion.tv] 
Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2014 12:09 AM
To: After Effects Mail List
Subject: Re: [AE] Depreciated output formats gone completely in AE 2014
 
to be a broken record, h.264 is NOT just web video. its capable of iFrame, deep color and high bit rates. please see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H.264 for a starter.
 
then realize panasonic P2 cameras record AVCintra 100 and 200 mbit 10 bit, basically equal to ProRes 422 and HQ. HDcam SR 440mbit is based on h.264
 
its a perfectly good delivery format if you use the higher end specs
 
S
 
On Jun 26, 2014, at 2:11 PM, Stephen van Vuuren <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:


I will chime in that on some of my boxes I had stopped using AE for H.264 due to crashes with export and started using AME and never had an issue or crash.
 
The one downside to AME is not having an export history saved with the project – not sure if that is even possible.
 
But h.264 as a final for clients? I can’t imagine doing that. ProRes 422 or Avid is about as uncompressed I would ever deliver. H.264 is just a proof/web format as it just won’t holdup to much after that.
 
stephen van vuuren
336.202.4777
 
 
A film is – or should be – more like music than like fiction. It should be a progression of moods and feelings. The theme, what’s behind the emotion, the meaning, all that comes later.
–Stanley Kubrick
 
From: After Effects Mail List [mailto:AE-List@media-motion.tv] 
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2014 2:45 PM
To: After Effects Mail List
Subject: Re: [AE] Depreciated output formats gone completely in AE 2014
 
I can vouch for this exact approach. Here’s a sample from last weekend, exported via AME using the Vimeo 1080p 29.97 preset.
 
 
Brian



You're asking for output directly from After Effects, but my answer is to use the Vimeo encoding presets in Adobe Media Encoder.
 
Just render and export a losslessly encoded master from After Effects into a watch folder that AME is monitoring, and let AME create the Vimeo file.
 
 
From: After Effects Mail List [mailto:AE-List@media-motion.tv]
 
What is a better alternative than .MOV H.264 for optimal qualityute for upload to Vimeo?
 
Requirements: 24 fps, 1080p, 44kHz Stereo, size < 200 Mb per 60 sec of video, direct render from AE output.

 
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