From: "Dirk de Jong" Received: from mail-yh0-f54.google.com ([209.85.213.54] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.10) with ESMTP-TLS id 5529977 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Sat, 19 Jul 2014 23:15:24 +0200 Received: by mail-yh0-f54.google.com with SMTP id v1so3146816yhn.41 for ; Sat, 19 Jul 2014 14:15:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=KTUAE0PzpuMm6L967l5+Sxcgb4QT35tFSmw48lHiIY0=; b=wxyYD6id2RcXIyQRGCbkdDo5gfrJT1P8mE7dxZuW+SWJr9m/8yEAQ8zIqxThtD/El6 LfXdbKLTdCu3l2tMyIyaCjfL6WnHWf0yNiOt9GPFc8LxhGmGVcTCZx8MoYOZVuCtwHly ai3NFamLeKUxHJO8kcuHEOMKe1kIVG57NjkznHXP1X8QWREDBMZMiDcJp8Bc0IkQxKCk Rp2unIUd/bU9RZccTr007lZqByDMUyc5q06TbBJDIkz2+IpiTZeXxKfbylGwN1wfzB4c fuObqr+tgy4beLKmydyIi8mQIiT68yFjZ8kWiC1L4lGJcthpJBFQm0HAceH0YCwAHGro hAJw== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.236.223.229 with SMTP id v95mr22513290yhp.128.1405804523664; Sat, 19 Jul 2014 14:15:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.170.224.7 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Jul 2014 14:15:23 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2014 17:15:23 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [update] Render Multiple Frames Simultaneously (MP option) problem To: After Effects Mail List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c1ecbe41ba1404fe925ffb --001a11c1ecbe41ba1404fe925ffb Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Sat, Jul 19, 2014 at 4:57 PM, Teddy Gage wrote: > if your comp viewer is set to a different resolution than your preview > resolution, it won't show you the cached preview on the timeline until they > match. > Good thought but that wasn't it. I achieve much better RAM preview lengths and render speed without the > virtual cores. > That's good to know and I'll consider that just as a general performance thing. After some more tests I was finding it working OK in another project but not my original one, and after a lot of reducing the original project I find that if you have done stabilization (AE Warp Stabilizer) within the project and it (Warp Stabilizer VFX effect) is enabled then this problem will occur - *even if the Warp Stabilizer effect is not in the current comp *(that's what fooled me the first time I tried to isolate it) - so it seems to be a bug that is an obscure conflict between Warp Stabilizer and RMFS PTR... oh, Saturday, where have yee gone ? : ) > > > > On Sat, Jul 19, 2014 at 3:59 PM, Dirk de Jong > wrote: > >> hanks for the reply, I've inserted some responses below >> >> On Sat, Jul 19, 2014 at 2:18 PM, Teddy Gage >> wrote: >> >>> How big is your hard drive cache set? What kind of drive is it on? SSD >>> or HDD? Also does it work as expected with RMFS turned off? >>> >> >> Yes this behavior (of losing PTR cache after a single PTR playback >> session) is specifically when using RMFS to do the PTR. If you turn off >> RMFS altogether or set RMFS to be render queue only then the PTR cache >> persists fine. >> >> My boot drive is a 256gig SSD drive with 130gigs free and I had AE disk >> cache set to 60gigs of that drive. I just tried switching the cache drive >> to a 2TB HDD with nothing on it and increasing the cache size but it didn't >> avoid the problem. I have another SSD drive I'll be installing when I get a >> chance. >> >> Here is what I think your problem is, your machine is starved for RAM - >>> with dual hex CPUs that's 12 physical cores (or 24 virtual!!) >>> >> >> yes, the AE Mem&MP Pref panel shows 24 processor cores >> >> >>> chewing through RAM - I have a 3930K (single hex) and I had to upgrade >>> to 64GB RAM to get decent preview length at full resolution in 1080p >>> >> >> but my problem is not (so far) with the duration of PTRs I'm getting, but >> rather that once the PTR is built (and the timeline shading indicates it is >> cached) it is gone as soon as I stop the initial PTR playback - *once it >> shows as cached with green in the timeline** it should** be cached till >> something changes, right ? (shouldn't that always be true?)* >> >> >>> couple things you can try: >>> >>> - try lowering amount of RAM per core in MP settings (to 1 or 2 GB per) >>> >> - Try previewing at lower res (third or quarter) >>> >> >> in troubleshooting it I had already dropped to SD resolution (and even >> that at half rez) and had the RAM per core set at 2GB and then even 1 GB >> but the problem still happens >> >> >>> - turn OFF hyperthreading on your CPUS in the BIOS OR limit AE to use 6 >>> or 12 CPUS in MP settings >>> >> >> I just set it to use 12, then only 4 CPUs by boosting the number of "CPUs >> reserved for other applications" in the AE MP prefs but it still loses PTR >> cache (BTW the only other app I've ever had running simultaneously with AE >> is Google Chrome but I did even try quitting that to see if it had anything >> to do with it but it didn't seem to) >> >> >>> - buy more ram. Honestly I would suggest 128 GB minimum for your setup >>> >> >> it's a possibility I'll be adding more RAM to this machine, but I'm >> unconvinced that the source of this particular problem is the amount of RAM >> installed (or RAM available when running AE) >> >> Anyway, I DO appreciate your suggestions and would welcome any more ideas >> you or anyone else on this list has to offer. >> > > > > -- > _____________________________ > VFX & Motion Graphic Artist > teddygage dot com > > -- > Dirk > BorisFX > dirkd@borisfx.com > > Things are not as they appear. > Nor are they otherwise. > - Lanka Sutra > > --001a11c1ecbe41ba1404fe925ffb Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

On Sat, Jul 19, 2014 at 4:5= 7 PM, Teddy Gage=A0<AE-List@media-motion.tv>=A0wrote:<= br>
if your comp viewer is set to a different resolution than = your preview resolution, it won't show you the cached preview on the ti= meline until they match.

Good thought but that wasn't it.

I achieve much better RAM = preview lengths and render speed without the virtual cores.

That's good to= know and I'll consider that just as a general performance thing.

=
After some more tests I = was finding it working OK in another project but not my original one, and a= fter a lot of reducing the original project I find that if you have done st= abilization (AE Warp Stabilizer) within the project and it (Warp Stabilizer= VFX effect) is enabled then this problem will occur - even if the Warp = Stabilizer effect is not in the current comp (that's what fooled me= the first time I tried to isolate it) - so it seems to be a bug that is an= obscure conflict between Warp Stabilizer and RMFS PTR...

oh, Saturday, where have yee go= ne ? : )






=
On Sat, Jul 19, 2014 at 3:59 PM, Dirk de Jon= g <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:
hanks for the reply, I've inserted some respons= es below

On Sat, Jul 19, 2014 at 2:18 PM, Teddy Gage=A0&= lt;AE-List@med= ia-motion.tv>=A0wrote:
How big is your hard drive cache set? What kind of drive i= s it on? SSD or HDD? Also does it work as expected with RMFS turned off?

Yes= this behavior (of losing PTR cache after a single PTR playback session) is= specifically when using RMFS to do the PTR. If you turn off RMFS altogethe= r or set RMFS to be render queue only then the PTR cache persists fine.

My boot drive is a 256gig SSD drive with 130gigs free and I had AE dis= k cache set to 60gigs of that drive. I just tried switching the cache drive= to a 2TB HDD with nothing on it and increasing the cache size but it didn&= #39;t avoid the problem. I have another SSD drive I'll be installing wh= en I get a chance.

Here is what I think your problem is, your machine is starved for RAM - wit= h dual hex CPUs that's 12 physical cores (or 24 virtual!!)

yes, the AE Mem&MP Pref panel shows 24 processor cores
=A0
chewing through RAM - I have a 3930K (single hex) and I ha= d to upgrade to 64GB RAM to get decent preview length at full resolution in= 1080p

but my problem is not (so far) with the duration of PTRs I'm gett= ing, but rather that once the PTR is built (and the timeline shading indica= tes it is cached) it is gone as soon as I stop the initial PTR playback -= =A0once it shows as cached with green in the timeline=A0it should=A0= be cached till something changes, right ? (shouldn't that always be tru= e?)
=A0
couple things you= can try:

- try lowering amount of RAM per core in MP setti= ngs (to 1 or 2 GB per)
- Try previewing at lower res (third or quarter)

in trouble= shooting it I had already dropped to SD resolution (and even that at half r= ez) and had the RAM per core set at 2GB and then even 1 GB but the problem = still happens
=A0
- turn OFF hyperthread= ing on your CPUS in the BIOS OR limit AE to use 6 or 12 CPUS in MP settings=

I just= set it to use 12, then only 4 CPUs by boosting the number of "CPUs re= served for other applications" in the AE MP prefs but it still loses P= TR cache (BTW the only other app I've ever had running simultaneously w= ith AE is Google Chrome but I did even try quitting that to see if it had a= nything to do with it but it didn't seem to)
=A0
- buy more ram. Honest= ly I would suggest 128 GB minimum for your setup

it'= ;s a possibility I'll be adding more RAM to this machine, but I'm u= nconvinced that the source of this particular problem is the amount of RAM = installed (or RAM available when running AE)

= Anyway, I DO appreciate your suggestions and would welcome any more ideas y= ou or anyone else on this list has to offer.



--
____________________= _________
VFX & Motion Gra= phic Artist
teddygage dot com

--
Dirk
BorisFXdirkd@borisfx.com

Things a= re not as they appear.
Nor are they otherwise.
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 = =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0=A0 - Lanka Sutra

--001a11c1ecbe41ba1404fe925ffb--