From: "Chris Zwar" Received: from mail-pl0-f45.google.com ([209.85.160.45] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.0) with ESMTPS id 6433551 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Tue, 10 Apr 2018 10:30:18 +0200 Received: by mail-pl0-f45.google.com with SMTP id x4-v6so7012636pln.7 for ; Tue, 10 Apr 2018 01:35:37 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=chriszwar-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to:message-id; bh=wZfKLvMZdun8VcrCvpqkkWmp4ANn10evr5KszmvLW6I=; b=wi7FcnI7TzZ9R8tY4J4NbzyDC7bbrafR8v/1yVj777HEUaKSlqhcuwoKYjnCb7fV5Q anicdfw//3yW6sN5wuPVQYRkCWs4QzyoRtVV44QcVfhj9UgbR1C2JqaljpDG8rQE4Q6B FvU/4WcOxuJmt+GK/L4iqEL5vmMybHGCv8JyT4PViLz1UB4REB+9g31Aj31PfzsjOXtO m3TGCuogc+emD/bZEvD/s3WZe40fg89PSJPimabtQBc7oQRio02zm8DVQBoX38gpaw9Z Pi3z4Kudneg9RXypFeYKDd0bxvmZXRVoZAax0D3niz9Q6C0I4dBVJi65iiEp7tNScAAO 2Fzw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to :in-reply-to:message-id; bh=wZfKLvMZdun8VcrCvpqkkWmp4ANn10evr5KszmvLW6I=; b=IfQu61bFvVpGrd3GhlM1z7K5UvbSyl5rPfAHC0EFZam5o4iFpaHW//HmdUX06JUVpQ Y52e6eZ5MLym/kgUm5gFxQcYrathx94PaC4BzEwGF59IvKkSyKqxy7xWU44QRB8lTFYo AqXb+Bei9zzx/L0ALC/bzcRPqjoxDNayO4gJSdyCWB+IBEz9sc8oY6tMwd5Jj7GV9Psy v/2nNJ26SF27a4Q67Z0E1zrKVPGeP7h5hCUqGY2dLpgADUqqF3AOvRtOQgBN3O8nMSVX s0qWs9n3025MWpaO/5fb70RQWQxMFguDAnBXMALaExTlubxmb24I9t1QbKwk+JiuFdF/ gJTA== X-Gm-Message-State: AElRT7En7HYwSxY13wnuNdBqs5g+MMkFA+Lc8gQYO4uGbQPgkSj9GDsF eprtE//H4w/uA9FjJBDuABLUpnzhGxU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx4/BRYvlPW/YlwmuOHFLmQqtAnMRbpSND39XZqEmKQxDtC7x8HT7fMlKmIaCvgfXvhPPkQItXg== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:20eb:: with SMTP id v40-v6mr42535190plg.277.1523349335393; Tue, 10 Apr 2018 01:35:35 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: Received: from [192.168.0.6] ([101.164.85.130]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id l74sm5058551pfi.138.2018.04.10.01.35.33 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 10 Apr 2018 01:35:34 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_2FD51381-399B-435C-B85A-8A802C993CE8" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.3 \(3445.6.18\)) Subject: Re: [AE] Unmult? Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 18:35:30 +1000 References: To: After Effects Mail List In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <3ABA46C4-E303-4A7E-AB83-F433522D0221@chriszwar.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.6.18) --Apple-Mail=_2FD51381-399B-435C-B85A-8A802C993CE8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Thanks for trying and sharing! > On 10 Apr 2018, at 6:32 pm, Roei Tzoref = wrote: >=20 > Great. Channel Combiner followed by remove color matting give the = precise result. >=20 > Thanks Chris. one more plugin I don't have to use :) >=20 > On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 5:59 AM, Chris Zwar > wrote: > Oh Ok. I haven=E2=80=99t looked at the AE preset, but I can see that = the problem is that it is using the shift channels to copy the lightness = value. This isn=E2=80=99t correct, the better way to do it is to use = the channel combiner plugin to copy the Max RGB value to the alpha = channel. >=20 > Try using that instead of shift channels and see if you get different = results. =20 >=20 >=20 >> On 10 Apr 2018, at 11:37 am, Roei Tzoref > wrote: >>=20 >> Thanks Chris, I have watched your tutorial a while back. this does = not solve the problem with Ae's unmult though... >> as I mentioned, Ae's Unmult preset, which simply does 2 things: Shift = Channels with take alpha from lightness + remove color matting, is not a = good tool for unmulting since it has a discoloring after effect which = AFAIK cannot be avoided. >>=20 >> a simple test confirms this. examples here: >> https://imgur.com/a/JoTb0 >>=20 >> AFAIK, the only way to unmult accurately in Ae is to use any of these = 3rd party plugins: Knoll Unmult, mekajik Unmult, VC Color Vibrance >>=20 >>=20 >> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 4:03 AM, Chris Zwar > wrote: >> Actually it=E2=80=99s the opposite. If you simply copy the lightness = into the alpha then the RGB is preserved entirely, but this isn=E2=80=99t = accurate. You need to use the remove colour matting plugin as well, = which then takes the background colour into account and adjusts = everything accordingly. >>=20 >> This video demonstrates what the remove colour matting plugin does = and why it=E2=80=99s important: >>=20 >> https://www.provideocoalition.com/alpha-channels-good-bad-ugly/ = >>=20 >>=20 >>> On 10 Apr 2018, at 10:57 am, Roei Tzoref > wrote: >>>=20 >>> Ae's Umult - Alpha from Lightness (Unmult) preset) unfortunately is = not optimal since it has a discoloring result. it does not preserve the = RGB information in it's entirety. I have seen not any way in Ae to = unmult natively without this discoloring effect. a simple test is taking = a black solid, adding a lens flare effect, then trying to unmult.=20 >>>=20 >>> another free option exists in the VC Color Vibrance plugin which is = free by video copilot:=20 >>> = https://www.videocopilot.net/blog/2016/02/color-vibrance-update-v1-06/ = >>>=20 >>> simply change the color to 0 to have no effect in color, and change = "matte alpha" to "on" >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 1:47 AM, Stephen van Vuuren = > wrote: >>> And if you want to mess around with more creative kind of options, = Brian Moffit eons ago suggested a Shift Channels (Take Alpha from = Luminance) and muck about the a levels effect to boost/lower alpha to = taste. >>>=20 >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: After Effects Mail List > >>> Sent: Monday, April 9, 2018 6:04 PM >>> To: After Effects Mail List > >>> Subject: Re: [AE] Unmult? >>>=20 >>> It=E2=80=99s not THAT cumbersome to do with standard AE tools=E2=80=A6= first you use the channel combiner, set the first option to Max RGB and = the second to Lightness. Then use the =E2=80=9Cremove colour matting=E2=80= =9D plugin. The combination of those two effects is the same as unmult. >>>=20 >>> > On 9 Apr 2018, at 11:43 pm, Byron Nash > wrote: >>> > >>> > Looks like Red Giant put their unmult effect into legacy status = and they have one in Universe now? What's the current pulse on which = unmult effect to use? Is there another option these days? >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> +---End of message---+ >>> To unsubscribe send any message to > >>>=20 >>> +---End of message---+ >>> To unsubscribe send any message to > >>>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail=_2FD51381-399B-435C-B85A-8A802C993CE8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Thanks for trying and sharing!

On 10 = Apr 2018, at 6:32 pm, Roei Tzoref <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:

Great. Channel Combiner followed by remove = color matting give the precise result.

Thanks Chris. one more plugin I don't = have to use :)

On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 5:59 AM, Chris Zwar <AE-List@media-motion.tv> = wrote:
Oh = Ok.  I haven=E2=80=99t looked at the AE preset, but I can see that = the problem is that it is using the shift channels to copy the lightness = value.  This isn=E2=80=99t correct, the better way to do it is to = use the channel combiner plugin to copy the Max RGB value to the alpha = channel.

Try using = that instead of shift channels and see if you get different results. =  


On 10 Apr 2018, at 11:37 am, Roei Tzoref = <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:

Thanks = Chris, I have watched your tutorial a while back. this does not solve = the problem with Ae's unmult though...
as I mentioned, Ae's Unmult = preset, which simply does 2 things: Shift Channels with take alpha from = lightness + remove color matting, is not a good tool for unmulting since = it has a discoloring after effect which AFAIK cannot be = avoided.

a simple test confirms = this. examples = here:
https://imgur.com/a/JoTb0

AFAIK, the only way to unmult accurately in Ae is to use any = of these 3rd party plugins: Knoll Unmult, mekajik Unmult, VC Color = Vibrance


On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 4:03 AM, = Chris Zwar <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:
Actually it=E2=80=99s the opposite.  If you simply copy = the lightness into the alpha then the RGB is preserved entirely, but = this isn=E2=80=99t accurate.  You need to use the remove colour = matting plugin as well, which then takes the background colour into = account and adjusts everything accordingly.

This video demonstrates what the remove = colour matting plugin does and why it=E2=80=99s important:

https://www.provideocoalition.com/alpha-channels-good-bad-ugly/


On 10 = Apr 2018, at 10:57 am, Roei Tzoref <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:

Ae's= Umult - Alpha from Lightness (Unmult) preset) unfortunately is not = optimal since it has a discoloring result. it does not preserve the RGB = information in it's entirety. I have seen not any way in Ae to unmult = natively without this discoloring effect. a simple test is taking a = black solid, adding a lens flare effect, then trying to = unmult. 

another = free option exists in the VC Color Vibrance plugin which is free by = video copilot: 
https://www.videocopilot.net/blog/2016/02/color-vibrance-update-v1-06/

simply change the color to 0 to have no effect in color, and = change "matte alpha" to "on"



On Tue, = Apr 10, 2018 at 1:47 AM, Stephen van Vuuren <AE-List@media-motion.tv> = wrote:
And if you want to = mess around with more creative kind of options, Brian Moffit eons ago = suggested a Shift Channels (Take Alpha from Luminance) and muck about = the a levels effect to boost/lower alpha to taste.

-----Original Message-----
From: After Effects Mail List <AE-List@media-motion.tv>
Sent: Monday, April 9, 2018 6:04 PM
To: After Effects Mail List <AE-List@media-motion.tv>
Subject: Re: [AE] Unmult?

It=E2=80=99s not THAT cumbersome to do with standard AE tools=E2=80=A6 = first you use the channel combiner, set the first option to Max RGB and = the second to Lightness. Then use the =E2=80=9Cremove colour matting=E2=80= =9D plugin.  The combination of those two effects is the same as = unmult.

> On 9 Apr 2018, at 11:43 pm, Byron Nash <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:
>
> Looks like Red Giant put their unmult effect into legacy status and = they have one in Universe now? What's the current pulse on which unmult = effect to use? Is there another option these days?


+---End of message---+
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