From: "Steve Oakley" Received: from mout.perfora.net ([74.208.4.194] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.0) with ESMTPS id 7117739 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Wed, 18 Jul 2018 07:14:39 +0200 Received: from [10.1.1.99] ([71.87.57.30]) by mrelay.perfora.net (mreueus003 [74.208.5.2]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LmMSa-1gEAP12Vjm-00ZwfN for ; Wed, 18 Jul 2018 07:23:17 +0200 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_EF573350-C852-4E94-9DEB-4B697D062E98" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) Subject: Re: [AE] Lack of QuickTime + HAP codec support Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2018 00:23:15 -0500 References: To: After Effects Mail List In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:iM0wUgej5jWox6WHLqB7zHj79a66mueH4GE41+8h9pTuJ3r7FSn pWl+kxlc8lPyR1T3bQft//vHPJ47oiW0/1LwXaf8kNKV97XGMKacDlXUqdaQwIlGpBQM0WD AKxK5K+BbQeQLeQuANT6+k1hxuGW0G+KdI4iSzyIKn1ZUCufWo4cdQCeKDixd+bDKkykO8z SYdouQlKCOpGY25r/Bw6A== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:W5fMqFBRXsQ=:xEiHPzz/E0TWHeJsZdg0HQ v6TmXUK2gd5ZAEcBvA7yg1Fg6KZZSYirCW2Ga2ou/iJ1tPyQv1KxgxBfxWUCbIgkzsvQLsg0R 1hPiD9bvCpp+1mLyYLP9ZjEjSvpde0dsBd8N3HIpKZvxWKB92NEy6WwTiue0QdXBFapCI6lfd kFEe7Bv9SiitAr3/u1OBtt7TKlAoZsTZmnbIJcNgBUpE9tM4Q6JMGkSjauKMVVK3CZ7Zfwr7I TVoI7pD6Bab8zgDtVpwHWZPTG4+cGAKzPofMW/E2SO9kgCzxcDcdchmdZ47WE4jY1tewLufpy 8+rO+0V+rfLQpyiI+5uuBH8N1ombCtIZKkDjWnKefqQ/RAtJFvP75QEReuqwlMY6CHb8Wf2RD cb6drwPauIeXgjOUpjKedFHTWKve/HCdMxirMO86f7M++qEPej3+WLllSUCujOvDfLNPke8vv fHLo1YhwlusQAuy4YAt6zJqVkxTY5raiOLamHVXTOauPWslPVIMiAcsjn4buOwKNJLEmXr/yK Kijkt/awH3zvHTiTOx5QRZQqgboxzaePVFR0U3f4FGnZfzz90Ub8tti4VdjPDFgU1BItkqifw s740fvWM5inJF7krMrPKLJFNoOac4AvCzG/+k4TOfAHtbBJTVj7q4D8SkJlryjzjFr/F0pERv YWBWr1PxJpKnrn6qGAySkXI6vqD5Y+FE3E0UvET1k0p7PYIO9Lx/xGU3B8SLtcuDK9pnKhWKK EmTKRasGlQZoS9Gl --Apple-Mail=_EF573350-C852-4E94-9DEB-4B697D062E98 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 apple, and community leaders have for _years_ been saying QT32 and its = codecs are going away. this has especially been true for the last year. = I know I=E2=80=99ve posted this any number of times. if you have been = ignoring the warnings, thats no one else=E2=80=99s fault. apple made it = clear with the release of 10.12 and 10.13.0 this was happening. adobe = could of been a bit more proactive in also repeating the apple message = but=E2=80=A6 this is not a surprise. > On Jul 16, 2018, at 1:43 PM, Dennis Wilkins = wrote: >=20 > Adobe tends to focus on stuff that benefits the most users, leaving = niche stuff, like HAP, to third parties. > What I=E2=80=99m saying is that it was their decision to just drop all = of the codecs at once without alerting their users; they could have = posted an alert with a questionnaire years ago asking what codecs were = needed by their users and make their decisions accordingly. This is just = another case of Adobe not supporting it=E2=80=99s customers very well. adobe has created or licensed any number of common codecs that come in = QT from DV 25/50/100 thru Mpeg2 and ProRes, DNxHD and just added their = own support for animation. its a respectable list of common codecs used = in pro environments. that said, the entire AC3 dolby stuff and not = being able to install several versions of CS was a huge blunder and they = should make a peace offering to dolby=E2=80=A6=20 as for HAP, its an oddball old codec and totally small niche. ya, its = for some old creaky video playback hardware. well maybe its time the = vendor for that hardware stepped up with a codec / encoder app to = support their own hardware. its not like *they* didn=E2=80=99t also know = this was coming.. or get with apple to create a proper 64bit = AVfoundation component to support their products. while we=E2=80=99re at = it, how about cinepak ? Mpeg1 ? h.263 ? sometimes you let the past be = the past. you can always dual boot into an old flavor of OSX to encode = it too=E2=80=A6=20 S > I=E2=80=99m all for third party software - After Effects would be = irrelevant at this point without it. But should we really have to rely = on third parties for multi-process rendering, sub-sample erode-dilate, = etc. etc. Adobe makes a ton of money off of it's users, and then we have = apologists saying =E2=80=9Cpoor Adobe=E2=80=9D while they take our = money. >=20 > Lastly, this isn=E2=80=99t meant to imply that the After Effects = development team sucks, it=E2=80=99s that they likely don=E2=80=99t have = the resources necessary to do what is needed (another decision made by = the management at Adobe, not Apple). >=20 > - Dennis >=20 >=20 >=20 >> On Jul 16, 2018, at 11:20 AM, Jim Tierney > wrote: >>=20 >> >> They are responsible for insuring support for the codecs that they = offer in their apps. >> =C2=A0 <> >> So=E2=80=A6 they need to re-write/implement every codec that was = available for Quicktime? You=E2=80=99re basically asking them to = re-write Quicktime and I don=E2=80=99t think you understand how much = work that would be. Adobe tends to focus on stuff that benefits the most = users, leaving niche stuff, like HAP, to third parties. They can=E2=80=99t= do everything, everyone wants. And it sounds like the AfterCodecs = product has filled that gap. Although, you could just render it out and = then use an older version of CC to transcode it. >> =20 >> Jim >> ------------------- >> Jim Tierney >> President >> Digital Anarchy >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 --Apple-Mail=_EF573350-C852-4E94-9DEB-4B697D062E98 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 apple, and community leaders have for _years_ been saying = QT32 and its codecs are going away. this has especially been true for = the last year. I know I=E2=80=99ve posted this any number of times. if = you have been ignoring the warnings, thats no one else=E2=80=99s fault. = apple made it clear with the release of 10.12 and 10.13.0 this was = happening. adobe could of been a bit more proactive in also repeating = the apple message but=E2=80=A6 this is not a surprise.

On Jul 16, 2018, at 1:43 PM, Dennis Wilkins <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:

Adobe tends to focus on stuff that benefits the most users, = leaving niche stuff, like HAP, to third parties.
What I=E2=80=99m saying is that it was their decision to just = drop all of the codecs at once without alerting their users; they could = have posted an alert with a questionnaire years ago asking what codecs = were needed by their users and make their decisions accordingly. This is = just another case of Adobe not supporting it=E2=80=99s customers very = well.

adobe = has created or licensed any number of common codecs that come in QT from = DV 25/50/100 thru Mpeg2 and ProRes, DNxHD and just added their own = support for animation. its a respectable list of common codecs used in = pro environments.  that said, the entire AC3 dolby stuff and not = being able to install several versions of CS was a huge blunder and they = should make a peace offering to dolby=E2=80=A6 

as for HAP, its an oddball old codec and totally = small niche. ya, its for some old creaky video playback hardware. well = maybe its time the vendor for that hardware stepped up with a codec / = encoder app to support their own hardware. its not like *they* didn=E2=80=99= t also know this was coming.. or get with apple to create a proper 64bit = AVfoundation component to support their products. while we=E2=80=99re at = it, how about cinepak ? Mpeg1 ? h.263 ? sometimes you let the past be = the past. you can always dual boot into an old flavor of OSX to encode = it too=E2=80=A6 

S

I=E2=80=99m all for third party software - After Effects = would be irrelevant at this point without it. But should we really have = to rely on third parties for multi-process rendering, sub-sample = erode-dilate, etc. etc. Adobe makes a ton of money off of it's users, = and then we have apologists saying =E2=80=9Cpoor Adobe=E2=80=9D while = they take our money.

Lastly, this isn=E2=80=99t meant to imply that the After = Effects development team sucks, it=E2=80=99s that they likely don=E2=80=99= t have the resources necessary to do what is needed (another decision = made by the management at Adobe, not Apple).

- Dennis



On Jul 16, 2018, at 11:20 AM, Jim Tierney = <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:

>> They are responsible for = insuring support for the codecs that they offer in their apps.
 
So=E2=80=A6 they need to re-write/implement every codec that = was available for Quicktime? You=E2=80=99re basically asking them to = re-write Quicktime and I don=E2=80=99t think you understand how much = work that would be. Adobe tends to focus on stuff that benefits the most = users, leaving niche stuff, like HAP, to third parties. They can=E2=80=99t= do everything, everyone wants. And it sounds like the AfterCodecs = product has filled that gap. Although, you could just render it out and = then use an older version of CC to transcode it.
 
Jim
-------------------
Jim Tierney
President
Digital Anarchy
 
 
 
<= /div>
= --Apple-Mail=_EF573350-C852-4E94-9DEB-4B697D062E98--