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boundary="_000_DM5PR10MB1819567D9F899478EFA2C9ABDE530DM5PR10MB1819namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: cramer.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 22a74188-d220-4ad2-a6f7-08d5ec823bee X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 18 Jul 2018 07:44:03.6630 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 1d1326b3-ae13-483a-83e6-7b0d31e331dd X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DM5PR10MB1835 --_000_DM5PR10MB1819567D9F899478EFA2C9ABDE530DM5PR10MB1819namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Good points. However, if you want to edit or preview the HAP encoded = video, you can=E2=80=99t do it in Adobe products. GPU accelerated encoding = is not the past and might be the future. I think Adobe support and embrace = the future=E2=80=A6 From: After Effects Mail List Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 2:10 AM To: After Effects Mail List Subject: Re: =5BAE=5D Lack of QuickTime + HAP codec support Hap's not that old--it's an open-source project launched by Vidvox in = 2013. It's niche, sure, but VR, theatrical projection, and signage all = have a need for GPU-accelerated playback of very high-res video. (H.264 is = the only codec with GPU support on lots of consumer devices, and it's = limited to 4K.) I think ffmpeg is becoming the way to go in most situations, except for = archival projects or where people have specific complaints about its codec = quality. (For example, afaik its H.264 implementation is considered = excellent, but its ProRes output isn't as popular.) I imagine in the long run AE will end up with a simple preference that = lets you choose ffmpeg or AME encoding backends...for now though, = AfterCodecs is working well enough for me. Nick On Wed, Jul 18, 2018, 1:23 AM Steve Oakley = > wrote: apple, and community leaders have for _years_ been saying QT32 and its = codecs are going away. this has especially been true for the last year. I = know I=E2=80=99ve posted this any number of times. if you have been = ignoring the warnings, thats no one else=E2=80=99s fault. apple made it = clear with the release of 10.12 and 10.13.0 this was happening. adobe = could of been a bit more proactive in also repeating the apple message = but=E2=80=A6 this is not a surprise. On Jul 16, 2018, at 1:43 PM, Dennis Wilkins = > wrote: Adobe tends to focus on stuff that benefits the most users, leaving niche = stuff, like HAP, to third parties. What I=E2=80=99m saying is that it was their decision to just drop all of = the codecs at once without alerting their users; they could have posted an = alert with a questionnaire years ago asking what codecs were needed by = their users and make their decisions accordingly. This is just another = case of Adobe not supporting it=E2=80=99s customers very well. adobe has created or licensed any number of common codecs that come in QT = from DV 25/50/100 thru Mpeg2 and ProRes, DNxHD and just added their own = support for animation. its a respectable list of common codecs used in pro = environments. that said, the entire AC3 dolby stuff and not being able to = install several versions of CS was a huge blunder and they should make a = peace offering to dolby=E2=80=A6 as for HAP, its an oddball old codec and totally small niche. ya, its for = some old creaky video playback hardware. well maybe its time the vendor = for that hardware stepped up with a codec / encoder app to support their = own hardware. its not like *they* didn=E2=80=99t also know this was = coming.. or get with apple to create a proper 64bit AVfoundation component = to support their products. while we=E2=80=99re at it, how about cinepak ? = Mpeg1 ? h.263 ? sometimes you let the past be the past. you can always = dual boot into an old flavor of OSX to encode it too=E2=80=A6 S I=E2=80=99m all for third party software - After Effects would be = irrelevant at this point without it. But should we really have to rely on = third parties for multi-process rendering, sub-sample erode-dilate, etc. = etc. Adobe makes a ton of money off of it's users, and then we have = apologists saying =E2=80=9Cpoor Adobe=E2=80=9D while they take our money. Lastly, this isn=E2=80=99t meant to imply that the After Effects = development team sucks, it=E2=80=99s that they likely don=E2=80=99t have = the resources necessary to do what is needed (another decision made by the = management at Adobe, not Apple). - Dennis On Jul 16, 2018, at 11:20 AM, Jim Tierney = > wrote: >> They are responsible for insuring support for the codecs that they = offer in their apps. So=E2=80=A6 they need to re-write/implement every codec that was available = for Quicktime? You=E2=80=99re basically asking them to re-write Quicktime = and I don=E2=80=99t think you understand how much work that would be. = Adobe tends to focus on stuff that benefits the most users, leaving niche = stuff, like HAP, to third parties. They can=E2=80=99t do everything, = everyone wants. And it sounds like the AfterCodecs product has filled that = gap. Although, you could just render it out and then use an older version = of CC to transcode it. Jim ------------------- Jim Tierney President Digital Anarchy ________________________________ --_000_DM5PR10MB1819567D9F899478EFA2C9ABDE530DM5PR10MB1819namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <=21--=5Bif =21mso=5D><=21=5Bendif=5D--><=21--=5Bif gte mso 9=5D> <=21=5Bendif=5D--><=21--=5Bif gte mso 9=5D> <=21=5Bendif=5D-->

Good points. However, if you want to edit or = preview the HAP encoded video, you can=E2=80=99t do it in Adobe products. = GPU accelerated encoding is not the past and might be the future. I think = Adobe support and embrace the future=E2=80=A6

 

From: After Effects Mail List = <AE-List=40media-motion.tv>
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 2:10 AM
To: After Effects Mail List <AE-List=40media-motion.tv>
Subject: Re: =5BAE=5D Lack of QuickTime &=2343; HAP codec = support

 

Hap's not that old--it's an open-source project = launched by Vidvox in 2013. It's niche, sure, but VR, theatrical = projection, and signage all have a need for GPU-accelerated playback of = very high-res video. (H.264 is the only codec with GPU support on lots of consumer devices, and it's limited to = 4K.)

 

I think ffmpeg is becoming the way to go in = most situations, except for archival projects or where people have = specific complaints about its codec quality. (For example, afaik its H.264 = implementation is considered excellent, but its ProRes output isn't as popular.) 

 

I imagine in the long run AE will end up with a = simple preference that lets you choose ffmpeg or AME encoding = backends...for now though, AfterCodecs is working well enough for = me.

 

Nick

 

 

 

On Wed, Jul 18, 2018, 1:23 AM Steve Oakley = <AE-List=40media-motion.tv> = wrote:

apple, and community leaders have for _years_ = been saying QT32 and its codecs are going away. this has especially been = true for the last year. I know I=E2=80=99ve posted this any number of = times. if you have been ignoring the warnings, thats no one else=E2=80=99s fault. apple made it clear with the release of 10.12 = and 10.13.0 this was happening. adobe could of been a bit more proactive = in also repeating the apple message but=E2=80=A6 this is not a = surprise.



On Jul 16, 2018, at 1:43 PM, Dennis Wilkins = <AE-List=40media-motion.tv> = wrote:

 

Adobe tends = to focus on stuff that benefits the most users, leaving niche stuff, like = HAP, to third parties.

What I=E2=80=99m saying is that it was their = decision to just drop all of the codecs at once without alerting their = users; they could have posted an alert with a questionnaire years ago = asking what codecs were needed by their users and make their decisions accordingly. This is just another case of Adobe not supporting = it=E2=80=99s customers very well.

 

adobe has created or licensed any number of = common codecs that come in QT from DV 25/50/100 thru Mpeg2 and ProRes, = DNxHD and just added their own support for animation. its a respectable = list of common codecs used in pro environments.  that said, the entire AC3 dolby stuff and not being able to install several = versions of CS was a huge blunder and they should make a peace offering to = dolby=E2=80=A6 

 

as for HAP, its an oddball old codec and = totally small niche. ya, its for some old creaky video playback hardware. = well maybe its time the vendor for that hardware stepped up with a codec / = encoder app to support their own hardware. its not like *they* didn=E2=80=99t also know this was coming.. or get with = apple to create a proper 64bit AVfoundation component to support their = products. while we=E2=80=99re at it, how about cinepak ? Mpeg1 ? h.263 ? = sometimes you let the past be the past. you can always dual boot into an old flavor of OSX to encode it = too=E2=80=A6 

 

S



I=E2=80=99m all for third party software - = After Effects would be irrelevant at this point without it. But should we = really have to rely on third parties for multi-process rendering, = sub-sample erode-dilate, etc. etc. Adobe makes a ton of money off of it's users, and then we have apologists saying =E2=80=9Cpoor = Adobe=E2=80=9D while they take our money.

 

Lastly, this isn=E2=80=99t meant to imply that = the After Effects development team sucks, it=E2=80=99s that they likely = don=E2=80=99t have the resources necessary to do what is needed (another = decision made by the management at Adobe, not Apple).

 

- Dennis

 

 



On Jul 16, 2018, at 11:20 AM, Jim Tierney = <AE-List=40media-motion.tv> = wrote:

 

>> They are responsible for insuring support for the codecs that they offer in = their apps.

 =

So=E2=80=A6 = they need to re-write/implement every codec that was available for = Quicktime? You=E2=80=99re basically asking them to re-write Quicktime and = I don=E2=80=99t think you understand how much work that would be. Adobe = tends to focus on stuff that benefits the most users, leaving niche stuff, like = HAP, to third parties. They can=E2=80=99t do everything, everyone wants. = And it sounds like the AfterCodecs product has filled that gap. Although, = you could just render it out and then use an older version of CC to transcode it.

 

Jim

-------------------

Jim = Tierney

President

Digital = Anarchy

 

 

 

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