From: "Steve Oakley" Received: from mout.perfora.net ([74.208.4.194] verified) by media-motion.tv (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.0) with ESMTPS id 7483169 for AE-List@media-motion.tv; Mon, 23 Dec 2019 22:24:15 +0100 Received: from [10.1.1.102] ([75.129.149.237]) by mrelay.perfora.net (mreueus004 [74.208.5.2]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MxVGn-1jgp1w0UMD-00xpe4 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2019 22:24:13 +0100 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_37141A24-1AF9-42D1-8559-2B0EDFF91BF7" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.1\)) Subject: Re: [AE] Must watch Mac Pro models Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2019 15:24:12 -0600 References: To: After Effects Mail List In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.1) X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:vFk/zUq5l8Fz1uhYJzhsyBNwwsVgJ+pn9h25F59A5Q9xILAjESF zKtvkl+B64731udohk+CC1pe5KPhKVTQm5UsGKsTkGPOXdjHzzRnT1BPY4Q8pSb1ZB/AjXI dG7hP1UFgSQVDSGk6Blkc7B4NiijSaaKE6b5zCSzgoe6jv0WvTnWEkBiRlmaCqU27aM+72I wa1CqyPNyQiV7ldrLq7dA== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:WvbmQMvbgYg=:TLJEP5ZT6MIIUsvYIlGri/ t5uo23qoRd0cD10yuSlPwTaF/xGuRD2b1P3joIh4kI1k1EzvPRqU0nhbTSWJNe3UY1NUo777v uWWm/AXi/qIJJWYiL86aYcZgPeN2OhLThMu7edJb2FKm+STDtFo8ZmLC8tfgmBQCKTQXn+Nwy rn2/XMrRpqWwEHy2qR8uSrDkS4rMjlFtJmKuOW6BKPNAeShahSMTB6vTV7ESLXZQ3WxXBu5vo ZU+NoNpwya671OcfvWR3cFWnJXBgzdWS73gMYyHfXECoXFD9+f8syobXYA87dYE8zJ5cnMS2V 0h2ZUdnlEag0RgPicpfy1kqV5h7Ywzk172R+NMBmvEsp7IskVmUVRTXnYupyFOkzyw5csb/tW p7WSkegLArblzlxpuG0oB6vttMdiMDKCn8Lj2FwIL8etBnhy5/NF1h9ZzyE1ESSEU8TFjMdBb GxeWvDgK0zB7uQyWpnkaJMVN/in2LYQbbiNDkdu9Eiq9c7YJ3k4DUd7gtLfe7scz8vsFsWmE2 awUzZTx1HoEbAfLdPbyou4zPRdvRbStvw8HHFdk3F9dN3eK5fM91M2ZKBqN/64DGys2uZ9j82 ZhRIVTZr2b2yN0wdeKRScCSKp39qRHeiK6QDVonRFqFNjdNtwWdyrOvCD/QlZjI3e0F1g9idm uc+awrOSaZe44AIvSpkyHtvRPg2OD/QxJksketeK5SJfjpv3+wFu6m+xuj0c+P62X+vsbB8f0 iTFg0K/It3/UWHVXKR80GfkObX6UKkCJd8Jh3gT6xiFP7Rt/lIpk63G4HiqYhYI0rynrqW5X+ 8sCiGqqOO24QNhqspttysURUZqVeRc5Cr2YBjLk+MUQf9JO+CikxcV5uIFyOUTzcDz5V2unGS 3rjKyJNXw37Lv1f8L5XIY2n99pd8EioVvvM8lTr9s= --Apple-Mail=_37141A24-1AF9-42D1-8559-2B0EDFF91BF7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 with the benchmarks coming in, a loaded i9 imac for less than 1/2 the = price and a free 5K monitor equals the base mac pro, or even the next = CPU ver up. At least for CPU performance. On GPU the iMac Pro has some = better BTO that keeps it in the same playing field as the MP2019 for = less and still includes the free 5K screen. imac regular BTO options = are also GPU competitive with base model. The only way a MP2019 could = sort of make sense is to get a stripped base model, then upgrade the = CPU, RAM and SSD yourself=E2=80=A6=20 S > On Dec 23, 2019, at 1:48 PM, Stephen van Vuuren = wrote: >=20 > If you have not seen this two looks at a complete hardware teardown = and test of PCIe expansion options, they are must view: > =20 > https://youtu.be/xQGfVFpMpuQ > =20 > & > =20 > https://youtu.be/I0PnVHHTX1E > =20 > Mixed bags of news for those thinking buying base model and upgrading. = RAM, yes, CPU, yes, PCIe SSDs, yes with some caveats. GPUs and other = cards, YMMV. > =20 > The one thing missing is unclear how Apple will respond to all of = these upgrades =E2=80=93 only the memory and approved PCI cards/storage = kit(s) is clear from what I can tell. > =20 > It does appear there is a lot of wisdom in waiting the first round out = to see if third party (especially internal cables) and hack world opens = up the box. > =20 > And absolutely confirms that the thing is ridiculously overengineered = with crazy markup margins, so unless you are going to load it with top = end config, that engineering goes to waste. It=E2=80=99s simply = impossible to configure a reasonable price performance rig out of it at = this time. > =20 > Best, > =20 > stephen van vuuren > 336.202.4777 > =20 > http://www.insaturnsrings.com/ > http://www.sv2dcp.com/ > http://www.sv2studios.com/ > =20 > A film is =E2=80=93 or should be =E2=80=93 more like music than like = fiction. It should be a progression of moods and feelings. The theme, = what=E2=80=99s behind the emotion, the meaning, all that comes later. > =E2=80=93Stanley Kubrick > =20 > From: After Effects Mail List >=20 > Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 11:44 AM > To: After Effects Mail List > > Subject: Re: [AE] We can order a new MacPro tomorrow. > =20 > Dennis said: "As far as the new Mac Pro goes, I=E2=80=99m withholding = judgment until I see how Redshift, Octane and Unity work in their Metal = incarnations on the new machines." > =20 > This is totally where our motion department is right now. We're = running propped up cheesegraters with 1080 cards in them, would probably = all prefer to use OSX if we could, but it's going to come down to = support for the software we need to use. Which, in addition to AE, is = C4D, Octane, Redshift, Houdini, and a little bit of Nuke and = Maya/Arnold. > =20 > =46rom the day of the announcement, I was worried about them not = having Nvidia cards and how that is going to play out with a bunch of = software companies that have larger user bases on Windows/Nvidia to = support. > =20 > We actually have the budget to spend a bunch of money on computers but = its just feeling so hard to justify the Mac Pro for reasons in addition = to price. Very curious to see what the price differential for = comparable hardware ends up being. It's not even a question which way = I'd go if it was my own money. > =20 > This has been a good discussion to read. Thank y'all, > - Nathan > =20 > On Tue, Dec 10, 2019 at 8:35 AM Mike Abbott > wrote: > =20 >=20 > On 10/12/2019 15:55, Stephen van Vuuren wrote: > Windows OS will never be Mac OS and vice versa. But you can get 99% of = either on either. I move back and forth between both every day... > =20 >=20 > The other life saving application on Windows: Directory Opus: = https://www.gpsoft.com.au/ > > Think of it as Windows Explorer with a PhD. >=20 > =20 >=20 > Mike >=20 --Apple-Mail=_37141A24-1AF9-42D1-8559-2B0EDFF91BF7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 with = the benchmarks coming in, a loaded i9 imac for less than 1/2  the = price and a free 5K monitor equals the base mac pro, or even the next = CPU ver up. At least for CPU performance. On GPU the iMac Pro has some = better BTO that keeps it in the same playing field as the MP2019 for = less and still includes the free 5K screen.  imac regular BTO = options are also GPU competitive with base model. The only way a MP2019 = could sort of make sense is to get a stripped base model, then upgrade = the CPU, RAM and SSD yourself=E2=80=A6 

S

On Dec = 23, 2019, at 1:48 PM, Stephen van Vuuren <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:

If you = have not seen this two looks at a complete hardware teardown and test of = PCIe expansion options, they are must view:
 
https://youtu.be/xQGfVFpMpuQ
 
&
 
https://youtu.be/I0PnVHHTX1E
 
Mixed = bags of news for those thinking buying base model and upgrading. RAM, = yes, CPU, yes, PCIe SSDs, yes with some caveats. GPUs and other cards, = YMMV.
 
The one = thing missing is unclear how Apple will respond to all of these upgrades = =E2=80=93 only the memory and approved PCI cards/storage kit(s) is clear = from what I can tell.
 
It does appear there is a lot of wisdom in waiting the first = round out to see if third party (especially internal cables) and hack = world opens up the box.
 
And absolutely confirms that the thing is ridiculously = overengineered with crazy markup margins, so unless you are going to = load it with top end config, that engineering goes to waste. It=E2=80=99s = simply impossible to configure a reasonable price performance rig out of = it at this time.
 
Best,
 
stephen = van vuuren
336.202.4777
 
http://www.insaturnsrings.com/
http://www.sv2dcp.com/
http://www.sv2studios.com/
 
A film is =E2=80=93 or = should be =E2=80=93 more like music than like fiction. It should be a = progression of moods and feelings. The theme, what=E2=80=99s behind the = emotion, the meaning, all that comes later.
=E2=80=93Stanley = Kubrick
 
From: After Effects Mail List = <AE-List@media-motion.tv> 
Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 = 11:44 AM
To: After Effects Mail List = <AE-List@media-motion.tv>Subject: Re: [AE] We can order a new = MacPro tomorrow.
 
Dennis said:  "As far as the new = Mac Pro goes, I=E2=80=99m withholding judgment until I see how Redshift, = Octane and Unity work in their Metal incarnations on the new = machines."
 
This is totally where our motion department is right = now.  We're running propped up cheesegraters with 1080 cards in = them, would probably all prefer to use OSX if we could, but it's going = to come down to support for the software we need to use.  Which, in = addition to AE, is C4D, Octane, Redshift, Houdini, and a little bit of = Nuke and Maya/Arnold.
 
=46rom the day of the announcement, I was worried about them = not having Nvidia cards and how that is going to play out with a bunch = of software companies that have larger user bases on Windows/Nvidia = to support.
 
We actually have the budget to spend a bunch of money on = computers but its just feeling so hard to justify the Mac Pro for = reasons in addition to price.  Very curious to see what the price = differential for comparable hardware ends up being.  It's not even = a question which way I'd go if it was my own money.
 
This has been a good discussion to = read.  Thank y'all,
 - Nathan
 
On Tue, Dec 10, 2019 at = 8:35 AM Mike Abbott <AE-List@media-motion.tv> wrote:

 

On 10/12/2019 15:55, Stephen van Vuuren wrote:
Windows OS will never be Mac OS and vice versa. But you can = get 99% of either on either.  I move back and forth between both = every day...

 

The other life = saving application on Windows: Directory Opus: https://www.gpsoft.com.au/

Think of it as Windows Explorer with = a PhD.

 

Mike


= --Apple-Mail=_37141A24-1AF9-42D1-8559-2B0EDFF91BF7--